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Footpath Versus Footway Versus Pavement - whos right?

(13 posts)
  • Started 11 years ago by Radgeworks
  • Latest reply from slowcoach

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  1. Radgeworks
    Member

    Dear All, last night i was having a munch and a beer with a very good friend of mines, with shall we say a "legalese" background.
    We eventually got round to discussing the shamworks,and the lack of "cyclists dismount" or the more useful "shared use" signage about town.
    Certainly in places we have both been recently we realised we hadnt seen them about.
    Though i am sure there are some out there apart from the Multrees Walk nonsense.
    My friend seemed to be of the opinion that a pavement is only a pavement if there is a fully operational road beside it, and if the contractor and or council have processed the TRO properly, there should be signage erected to direct pedestrians and cyclists accordingly.
    He was of the opinion also that if there is no signage at all, then "all bets are off" as regarding the non cycling on pavements, as its no longer a pavement, but becomes a footway or shared use. He also disputes the legality of a cyclist dismount sign, as there is nothing reflecting the behaviours of pedestrians.
    I found all of this info really quite interesting, but given the nature of legislation and so on, was not sure how up to date or legal his take on things was.

    Throwing this wide open to you all for clarification.

    THIS IS NOT A CYCLIST LOOKING FOR AN EXCUSE TO CYCLE ON PAVEMENTS!!!

    Just opinions and advice please..

    R :-)

    Posted 11 years ago #
  2. chdot
    Admin

  3. Another thread discussed this recently. There is a distinction between footway and footpath (with no definition of pavement) and one has a road beside it, the other doesn't. What they both have in common is that cycling is not allowed on them unless they are specifically a cyclepath (shared use or otherwise). All in the Roads (S) Act, but buried away a bit - I'll dig out the specific thread later.

    Cyclists Dismount signs have no legal authority, merely advisory (where they are at, say, points at which a cyclepath crosses a junction - if they are where a footpath or footway starts then, yes, they're advisory, but reflecting that legally you shouldn't be cycling). Referring that to the lack of signs for pedestrians is nonsense as there are no limits on pedestrians, save on Motorways and certain designated roads such as the bypass (which do have signs up saying no pedestrians).

    And Multrees Walk is private land, ergo the owner can direct useage how he wants - there's absolutely nothing wrong (in a legal sense) with him putting up no cycling signs, and they ARE enforceable (by the landowner, who can ask you to leave for breaching his rules - though the Land Reform Act on that particular piece of private land could be interesting).

    Posted 11 years ago #
  4. Uberuce
    Member

    http://www.cyclingscotland.org/news/roads-legislation-and-core-paths/

    The above link says that once a path has been identified as a Core Path, then all bets are indeed off, unless you've got an engine. I don't know whether the legislation around electric-assist cycles exempts them, but I'd guess so.

    Edinburgh's Core Path Plan was apparently confirmed in 2008 and is mapped (amusingly poorly) here:

    http://www.edinburgh.gov.uk/downloads/file/3007/core_path_plan_map

    I think that means gnarly persons can apparently ride down the Vennel steps into the Grassmarket. I recommend against it, though.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  5. wee folding bike
    Member

    Why does the Edinburgh by pass get away with being a motorway in all but name?

    My first assumption is a cost saving exercise.

    The same isn't the case for the Bailieston - Newhouse section of the A8 which looks like motorway but isn't and on which I could (and have) cycled.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  6. steveo
    Member

    Probably because its not upto motorway standards, no continuous hard shoulder, insufficient "safety" barrier in the partition and a whacking great roundabout in the middle.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  7. chdot
    Admin

    Used to be legal to cycle on bypass (not fun) now banned.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  8. wee folding bike
    Member

    Even then it's a funny ban, as you may remember I had to visit the SQA in Dalkeith a couple of years ago and I was allowed to cross the road at one of the roundabouts.

    A friend and I were musing over the future of the M8. There are no buildings on the line of the Monklands canal, just a car park at Tesco in Coatbridge and even then it's mostly on the Dundyvan branch, almost all of the real route is clear apart from the M8. From Easterhouse to Townhead the canal is under the M8… for now.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  9. Cyclops
    Member

    The new segregated cycle facilities at the junction of the new A68 and the City Bypass must be the most underused (if ever?) in the country. The only way to access them is via the A68 which ends at this junction so you have to turn around and come back the way you just came.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  10. chdot
    Admin

    "The new segregated cycle facilities at the junction of the new A68 and the City Bypass"

    Don't remember seeing any?

    Where does it start?

    Posted 11 years ago #
  11. Cyclops
    Member

    "Don't remember seeing any?

    Where does it start? "

    They are on the roundabout at the junction itself - completely pointless as they don't lead anywhere you're legally allowed to cycle. It's possibly so people can enjoy 20 yards of cycling on traffic-free paths before they head back up the A68 from whence they just came.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  12. Uberuce
    Member

    Organise an audax along it with manned controls, then make out a full bells-and-whistle press release to the persons responsible.

    I'm not sure how many points a 0.02k audax is worth, mind.

    Posted 11 years ago #
  13. slowcoach
    Member

    I think the point of the end of A68 cycleway is that there is nowhere else to cycle to other than turning round and going back up the A68. So the 20m path gives you somewhere safe to pull off the road while you figure you'll have to go back/curse inconsiderate road planners, and it lets you cross via the splitter island rather than have to go round the roundabout.

    Posted 11 years ago #

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