According to the chat they had with John Beattie on the radio, it was 13 caught in just four rides along the very short measured section of road that they were using....
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Cycling News
Operation Close Pass in Edinburgh
(630 posts)-
Posted 7 years ago #
-
@threeforleith
We could play a game: What short road is it?
If I get first guess, I'll go for Lower Granton Road, though only 3.25 close passes per journey would be on the low side...
Posted 7 years ago # -
We could play a game: What short road is it?
Short section of road, not a short road. I believe that "short" here is less than half a mile.
Posted 7 years ago # -
My guess is Restalrig Rd, the narrow end up by Leith Links
Posted 7 years ago # -
Just a wee suggestion - kind of obvious but seems worth saying just because nobody else has...
Much of the power of this police intervention comes not from the actual people they catch (which of course is good), but from the message it sends. I have three aspects of this in mind:
1) People being afraid they might get caught.
2) People relating to the person on a bike in front as a potential police officer, and therefore a human being rather than a 'cyclist' (hence coming to the startling conclusion that 'cyclists' are also human).
3) People beginning to see that passing close to someone on a bike is something 'bad' in social terms (the old drink driving cultural change thing) - something their friends might look down on them for.I say all this bearing in mind that actually a whole load of people driving actually behave pretty well - but the minority who don't feel like they can get away with it (socially too). Actually their friends probably think they are a bit of a pillock but they don't quite feel brave enough to say so.
My (rather long winded) point is that we can wring most value out of this by making sure that Edinburgh as a whole knows that this is happening. Tweeting that it's happening. Writing on Facebook that it's happening. Chatting at work to non-cycling colleagues about it happening. Passing a comment to the bus driver about it happening. We don't necessarily need to make any point - just to make sure that Edinburgh really notices.
Like I say - kind of obvious, but I hope worth saying :-)
Posted 7 years ago # -
I thought a lot of the comments were quite fair, i.e. don't cycle on pavements, don't go through red lights, observe the rules of the road etc.
This doesn't mitigate or excuse the close pass problem but I think as cyclists we have to be realistic about the behaviour of humans as a whole, because in my eye cylists and drivers are exactly the same - a minority of cyclists cause carnage for everybody else and really shouldn't be on the road, just like car drivers. Granted there is a massive difference in terms of the potential injury hazard of hitting someone in these two forms of transport, but that isn't an excuse either.
I get fed up being close passed to the point I avoid cycling on busy roads as much as possible now, but I also get fed up watching numpty cyclists jumping the kerb and flying through red lights or putting themselves in danger by sneaking up on my blind side when I am trying to turn left in the car, which also happens on a daily basis on my commute to work. I have sympathy for the vast majority of drivers who drive safely and have to put up with that kind of idiocy whilst seeing no comeback on those who behave in that fashion.
tldr; people need to be less selfish and more considerate all round.
Posted 7 years ago # -
"a minority of cyclists cause carnage for everybody else and really shouldn't be on the road, just like car drivers"
Carnage? Really?
"sneaking up on my blind side"
No nearside mirror on your car?
Posted 7 years ago # -
Example: cycling through the red light at gilmore place crossroads and going down Tarvit Street the wrong way into the path of oncoming traffic. I see it all the time. Do you feel that is excusable?
Of course I have a nearside mirror. Do you feel that you should abdicate responsibility for not getting yourself knocked off your bike by appearing out of nowhere at the exact moment I am turning left?
Do you think a nearside mirror has no blind spots?
Most of all, do you feel that drivers are able to dedicate all their attention to their nearside mirror when negotiating a busy junction with traffic, pedestrians etc, and are therefore entirely at fault when a cyclist who wasn't in your mirror at all a second ago is suddenly looming large on your left and doing 20mph at the point when you are pulling left? Really?
There are a percentage of cyclists who clearly think that way. They shouldn't be on the road.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Example: cycling through the red light at gilmore place crossroads and going down Tarvit Street the wrong way into the path of oncoming traffic. I see it all the time.
You see it ALL the time?
I use that junction often (coming from Gilmore Place) and I can't remember seeing anyone cycle through a red light, far less head the wrong way down Tarvit St.
Am I in the minority?
Posted 7 years ago # -
There are a percentage of cyclists who clearly think that way. They shouldn't be on the road.
Perhaps or perhaps educated before they get themselves killed.
Posted 7 years ago # -
I see cyclists going the wrong way on Valleyfield regularly, but rarely on Tarvit. Never seen anyone go straight through red at King's junction, although they often edge through if turning left, sometimes on the pavement.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Yes I see stuff like that all the time. Not necessarily at that junction but it happens regularly. Just like I see idiots in cars going through red lights all the time.
My point is, most cyclists are sensible, most drivers are sensible. There are a minority in both camps who aren't. Both should be brought to account. I cycle a lot and it is my main passion in my life. I just don't think the bias here is always entirely justified. For example, the facebook comments you cited as horrific - that's a very strong word. A couple of trolls for sure but most comments weren't really that bad and a lot of them were justified.
Does that make me part of the problem in your eyes? I'm curious, because I do a lot of driving as well as cycling and I see problems on both sides.
Posted 7 years ago # -
"Am I in the minority?"
Probably.
But not about cycling on Tarvit Street.
Can't be many who would rather go that way than via Valleyfield.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Some pics here:
Posted 7 years ago # -
Carnage? Really?
There is no 'bike' in CARnage! :-)
Posted 7 years ago # -
"I thought a lot of the comments were quite fair, i.e. don't cycle on pavements, don't go through red lights, observe the rules of the road etc."
None of that has anything to do with the operation being announced. The implication that the police shouldn't prioritise victims who are riding bikes because other people who ride bikes sometimes commit unrelated offenses while doing so is absurd.
It'd be like saying the police shouldn't focus on burglary because some people who live in houses have speeding tickets.
Posted 7 years ago # -
None of that has anything to do with the operation being announced. The implication that the police shouldn't prioritise victims who are riding bikes because other people who ride bikes sometimes commit unrelated offenses while doing so is absurd.
I agree entirely with you, so if you think I am arguing against promotion of cyclist safety you haven't read my posts properly.
I wrote to Police Scotland myself about the West Midlands operation asking for a similar program in Edinburgh - I am glad they have actually made moves in the right direction.
Posted 7 years ago # -
I don't think that, I'm simply saying the comments aren't at all fair. They're dehumanising of an outgroup and imply collective responsibility where none exists.
Posted 7 years ago # -
The pictures definitely look like where we saw them last week. A wide 4 lane 30mph road. No excuses for passing in lane.
I hadn't twigged they are calling it close call rather than close pass before this photoset.
Posted 7 years ago # -
What amazes me is the number of comments along the lines of:
"But what if there's a car coming the other way - are you saying I should have to wait?"Ummmmm, yes!
There's obviously frustrations elsewhere about people cycling on pavements, valid concerns about cycling up nearside of HGVs (in the painted cycle lane), less valid concerns about people not using the cycle lane. It feels like some of the WMP evidence-based policing needs to be displayed but I think in many cases people wouldn't read it or want to believe it anyway.
There are also a good number of uninformed rants about hi-vis, insurance, road tax...
I love the dichotomies about how cyclists shouldn't be on the road but shouldn't be on the pavement (and we shouldn't be building segregated lanes either). Likewise that cyclists simultaneously bring traffic in the city to a standstill and mow people down willy nilly on the pavements. It feels as if we've got a fundamental misunderstanding that people who cycle, aren't "cyclists". They're human beings who want to get from A-B. Many also drive & use the bus, most walk. Cycling is just another means of making that journey and at the moment has to share with either motorised transport on the road, or pedestrians on shared use paths.
Of course infra is the missing link here.
Incidentally was driving up north near my folks' place and came up behind a group of people out cycling on a country road with thick hedges both sides - looked like a couple of families out together. Most drivers were very courteous, left lots of space and crossed the centreline fully. It was however frustrating that these people cycling didn't group up in twos - would have made life a lot easier if they were two abreast!
My point again is that the comments moaning about cyclists two abreast are utterly ridiculous and it should only be a problem if you don't overtake properly!
Posted 7 years ago # -
Fair enough Rob, apologies for misinterpreting your view. I do hope the operation is the start of something that will make a difference in the long term.
Posted 7 years ago # -
http://road.cc/content/news/221478-police-scotland-launch-operation-close-pass-edinburgh
NOTHING on Twitter today
https://mobile.twitter.com/search/live?q=%23operationclosepass
Posted 7 years ago # -
What amazes me is the number of comments along the lines of:
"But what if there's a car coming the other way - are you saying I should have to wait?"I've had a police officer express surprise when I told him I don't overtake if there are solid white lines. He clearly does so himself.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Yep - the 10mph or less rule seems to be commonly interpreted as "I'll assume that any cyclist must be at a crawl". Worst place I've seen for that is the road into Dalkeith from Musselburgh, past Dalkeith Country Park.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Posted 7 years ago #
-
Enjoying the person who's taken to twitter to moan about the fact they got caught passing too close and that they drive 100,00 miles a year (presume that's 10,000 not 100.00 in European speak!). Quick to invoke Godwin's law as well.
Posted 7 years ago # -
Posted 7 years ago #
-
@nobrakes sorry, it frustrates me that I'm sharing the road with people who think it's perfectly acceptable to endanger me based on what someone else has done.
Think about it - they're not arguing it isn't dangerous or it doesn't happen. They're arguing you deserve it. Even the people doing these things don't deserve to be put in a life threatening situation because of it.
Posted 7 years ago #
Reply »
You must log in to post.
posts
