Thanks Tulyar for this feedback on your work. Your stamina is strong young Padwan
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Questions/Support/Help
Getting an unreserved bike on the train
(74 posts)- Started 4 years ago by Andrew-AWS
- Latest reply from chdot
- This topic is
not resolved
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Posted 4 years ago #
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Does anyone know if bike reservations are required on trains from Edinburgh terminating in Arbroath? All trains are coming up with no availability for a date 2 weeks hence.
Posted 2 years ago # -
No but
“
You’ll find designated cycle spaces on all of our trains. The majority of services operate non reservable cycle spaces on a first come first served basis, so you should bear this in mind when travelling at peak times.
The following routes however, do operate compulsory reservations for cycle spaces and you must reserve a space before attempting to travel. As these routes are long distance, they are often very busy and it may therefore not be possible to accommodate your cycle if you have not reserved a space.
Glasgow, Edinburgh and Aberdeen
Glasgow, Edinburgh and Inverness
Glasgow, Oban, Fort William and Mallaig
Aberdeen and Inverness
Inverness, Wick, Thurso and Kyle of Lochalsh“
https://www.scotrail.co.uk/plan-your-journey/cycling/bikes-trains
As I understand it, essentially it depends on the type of train.
If ScotRail HST/125 (4 coach - 2 spaces I think - supposed to be more, sometime…), almost certainly.
If things like 170s (3 coach should be 4 bike spaces) not bookable (probably) and shouldn’t be an issue.
So should be fine for those terminating at Arbroath, but there aren’t as many as those that continue to Aberdeen.
Posted 2 years ago # -
No reservations required on the Arbroath trains according to NationalRail.co.uk
Posted 2 years ago # -
Thanks chdot, that makes sense. Thanks to your RTT link, I now see I can book bike spaces on trains going to/emanating from Aberdeen but not those from Arbroath/Dundee.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Great!
Posted 2 years ago # -
Reminds me to chase-up the outcomes from that ITT for HST work on 2 packages
- remove 3 pairs of seats, install 6 tip up seats along bodyside to deliver 3m of 'bike space' in saloon for 4 bikes (officially) - but reluctance to say this will take tandems (a campaign here)
- deliver bike racks that work in power cars - this element to deliver after protocols agreed with staff on opening doors and loading bikes. Sadly limiting to 3 per van space, when 4-5 can fit easily with a proven design that has been in use for over 30 years on buses, trams & trains
Since I'm no longer paid on a retainer by CyclingUK for this work, some ideas/advice on covering the costs would be handy
In other news - the Class 153 'Activity Carriages' have been introduced, albeit with an accelerated acceptance programme. One vehicle operates a diagram of 2 return trips - which don't align well with the main (midday) sailings
- evening train = 5 coach splitter Glasgow to Oban & Fort Bill
- early morning = 3 coach Oban-Glasgow
- mid morning (10.20-ish) = 3 coach Glasgow-Oban
- afternoon = 3 coach Oban-Glasgow then to depotThe need to make checks &c can mean that the carriage is CAPE & you can check this with RealTimeTrains which shows which units are running
Further Oban-related detail
- Hitrans is funding fitting of cycle racks for Craigs of Campbelltown bus services on Mull
- Hitrans has funded Brompton Hire at Oban Station (& also at Elgin, with Inverness to follow once details are sorted)Posted 2 years ago # -
Anyone know if you can currently book a bike on a ScotRail train through the ScotRail website? The option to book a bike space is there, but none ever seem to be available despite reservations being required on the route I want to travel.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Think ‘best option’ was to phone (apparently extra helpful people in Oban).
Don’t know if that’s still the case.
Don’t know the number.
Just being helpful…
Posted 2 years ago # -
Now might be the time for an FoI EIA request for the trains running with their allocation of reserveable cycle spaces over specified periods (total reserveable spaces available), and match this against the reservations actually made.
If any part of a journey involves a train with non-reserveable spaces, then the system cannot give you a reservation because it cannot guarantee the through journey. Sometimes splitting the journey will make reservations reappear on the reservable sections
Posted 2 years ago # -
Yes - I booked a train journey to Inverness recently. Reservation not possible online, because it's apparently not possible to reserve a bike space on the Edinburgh-Stirling part of the journey. Phone call did eventually sort it out.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Thanks all - I have an aversion to dealing with call-centres, so will swing by Haymarket tomorrow.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Not a call centre as such - it’s ScotRail people.
(Unless changed/downgraded)
Posted 2 years ago # -
The late Ian Pragnall (Bespoke Highland Cycle Tours) had a bothy/cottage up near Morar but lived & worked in Glasgow (at the Beatson)
He made ALL the rail bookings for his tours through the staff at Fort William Station - with a long standing arrangement. The connection with local staff who had daily contact with the train crews, meant that the bookings were very smoothly managed (and an informal spare parts relay service was occasionally used when a bike broke-down)
It makes a lot of sense to develop such a relationship with a local staffed station. The stations at Fort Bill, Aviemore, and even Inverness don't really show the ticket sales revenue relevant to their passenger numbers, as most journeys are returns bought in Edinburgh, Glasgow or London. So boosting ticket sales revenue at your local station helps to secure a staff presence, plus staff who build up a knowledge of the tweaks that unlock the details of having a section of the journey on a non-reservable service and thus not releasing a reservation on the reserveable part.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Well, despite the best efforts of a very helpful chap ay Haymarket, it seems booking a return trip for one person and a bike on a train between Edinburgh and Inverness, two months in advance, is simply too much for our rail system to cope with.
Posted 2 years ago # -
So you weren’t able to do it?
Is the 2 months in advance the issue?
Did you find out when it could be booked?
Posted 2 years ago # -
@chdot - reservations are open and I thought booking early might mean I could snag one. No such luck.
Through a bit of jiggery-pokery, the chap found a way to book the outward trip (although not on the train I wanted) but no bike reservations were available on the day of the return trip. The guy had no idea why that might be the case.
Posted 2 years ago # -
So he couldn’t see if there were spaces that had been booked?
Generally not enough capacity…
Posted 2 years ago # -
@Morningsider - was the jiggery pokery splitting the journey at Stirling?
Posted 2 years ago # -
@Frenchy - journey was split at Perth.
@chdot - think the system only told the guy there were no spaces bookable. The fact that no space was available on any Inverness-Edinburgh train (or combo of trains) seemed to surprise him.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Posted 2 years ago #
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Just read this tweet and added to the thread. Here is a big lobby point for local elections (unitary councils have big influence on RTP's & Hitrans has been delivering already) plus bending the ear of MSP's & tourism groups
1) There are generally seats and cycle spaces on the Serco-contract Caledonian Sleeper Services, which leave Edinburgh Waverley for Inverness, Aberdeen, and Fort Bill - this weekend shorter trains are running in to & out of Kings Cross rather than Euston, as WCML is closed for 4 days
Normal service
Heading North - mornings
- incoming train from Euston arrives 03.50, often early
- an hour of slick splitting & shunting, delivers trains for Aberdeen (04.39 (07.34)), Inverness (04.21 (08.35 - connection for Kyle of Lochalsh 08.55/ Aberdeen 09.01/sadly Citylink 961 for Ullapool & Stornoway leaves at 08.10, with a 1 hour connection overlap at Ullapool) and Fort William (04.50 (09.57 - Mallaig 10.15 West Coast Railways - Jacobite)). The latter gets a day coach and lounge coach added, and bikes booked from Euston are transferredHeading South
- Aberdeen depart 21.43
- Inverness depart 20.45
- Fort Bill depart 19.50Arcane & revenue/capacity defending 'rules' OFFICIALLY prohibit passengers getting off the Aberdeen and Inverness services in Edinburgh (but you can get on & off the Fort Bill train, just as you cannot get on this train South or off North, when it stops at Glasgow Queen Street or Springburn due to the conditions set by SPT)
If we really want some serious committment some of these official conditions, and the timetable detail that means the Fort William train heading North runs c.20 minutes behind the train that could a) provide a cycle carrying connection to Oban & b) run as a 3-coach service with the 20-bike activity carriage, and connect with the pre-midday Inner Isles sailings
Instead of hanging around at Waverley for 1 hour waiting to depart the sleeper might depart early enough to connect with the Oban service at say Dalmuir or Dumbarton Central, with the more agile DMU, taking passengers for the stations between Dumbarton and Crianlarich
Perhaps a supporting shot for Scotrail taking back the sleeper service, and possibly providing the train crews for all services North of Edinburgh and Glasgow, as was done with a GNER train during the 2014 games - operated as a 600-seat last train back to Edinburgh by Scotrail, every night
2) leverage with Scottish Citylink on a topic I've been requesting through the past 4 MD's, to make bike spaces reservable on their coaches, using the same system (via counter or call centre) to book a seat - fee £1 - when you are using a Saltire Card, or an open return or carnet fare. If Ember can do this already....
Ask also that (with the reduced hold capacity and access in 'deckers' (80 seats vs 65 per coach) the option of the European solution of a 'ski box' a detachable booster for stowing skis, extra luggage ... and bikes might soon be tested in the UK - up to 6 bikes secured to a frame that can - be attached/removed without the use of workshop facilities - in C&U terms 'a receptacle' which can extend the limit of vehicle length beyond that for a whole rigid vehicle (15m)
Posted 2 years ago # -
I'll pop this in here rather than start another new topic: What's the general experience with trains that have "No designated spaces. Cycles permitted in vestibule at traincrew discretion" for their cycling info on the National Rail site? A distant cousin of mine has been making noises about offering to straight-swap my Edinburgh flat for his house in Bathgate that's a fair bit nicer than I could afford if I just sold up and went looking for something, but on the occasions I might want to get back into the city(especially on less enticing winter evenings) being able to skip ~15 miles of ride would be handy(I don't own a car and don't plan to), yet all the trains I look up on the timetable have that statement, there and back.
I don't much fancy missing an appointment or having some grumpy guard at Waverly sentence me to ride all the way back at 11pm when it's peeing with rain etc, is that kind of thing a likely prospect or is it generally not a big problem?
Posted 1 year ago # -
@Yodhrin - the Class 334s used on the Bathgate service have banks of tip up seats that provide an area for bike storage. The few times I have taken a bike on these services I haven't had any problem, but I haven't travelled at peak times on week days.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Generally *ought* to be ok.
SR onboard crew seem to be more understanding these days and tend not to be unduly bothered with more than 2 bikes in ‘space for two bikes’.
But if it looks like becoming a problem either get a folder OR keep a cheap bike at Waverley.
Enjoy your new home!
Generally colder and icier out there of course…
Always worth avoiding ‘last train’ if you have the option. Don’t know the route at that time of day, but would be surprised if you saw another bike.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Just noticed
“Operates without a guard”
AND 6 coaches all(?) the time.
Should NOT be a problem.
Posted 1 year ago # -
All right sweet thanks, now I'll just have to work on nudging him towards talking to his wife about it less and his lawyer about it more :P
Posted 1 year ago # -
Not Bathgate but in general, it goes without saying that for a last train, if you board at Waverley rather than Haymarket and are there ~10-15 mins before the train is due to depart your chances go up significantly.
It also goes without saying that there will always be one time where you do everything right, but there is a 2 carriage train and an "unhelpful" guard.
chdot's idea of leaving a cheap bike locked at Waverley overnight is a good one.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Bathgate trains are busy at commuting times yes but outside that if you follow Paddy Irish’s advice you should be fine getting bike on.
Arriving a bit pissed with a minute to go and still got a ticket to buy, might come a cropper.
Great cycling in the Bathgate Alps.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Has anyone tried taking a train with a bike trailer? Specifically the one to North Berwick.
Scotrail's site says they will take a cargo bike up to 2.5m long but there's no mention of the cargo bit being a trailer.
Posted 1 year ago #
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