Significant difference in frame strength: gents vs ladies?

CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Debate!

Significant difference in frame strength: gents vs ladies?

(51 posts)

Started 13 years ago by seanspotatobusiness
Latest reply from ian

No tags yet.

12 Next »

seanspotatobusiness
Member

I'm considering "investing" in a new Pashley Sovereign Princess or Roadster bike. I like the convenience of a step-through frame (I became accustomed to the comfort in the Netherlands) but, I want this bike to last as long as possible (decades?). I don't much care for the basket (though I think it's unfair that the Roadster costs the same as the Princess despite the fact that it comes with no such accessory *and* has a less convenient bike stand, in my opinion. Should I consider the shape of the frame for the purpose of maximising longevity?

My sense of masculinity is robust enough that I don't care whether my bike model name is 'Princess' and the design originally drafted for the convenience of dress- and skirt-clad ladies ;)

Posted 13 years ago #
Kirst
Member

I wouldn't want to be cycling a Pashley around Edinburgh hills - they're heavy!

Posted 13 years ago #
kaputnik
Moderator

^^What Kirst said^^

I think the way they build the step-through frames is that they use thicker / stronger / heavier tubing to compensate for the potential reduction in strength. So I don't think you'd find one dies of natural causes before the other. I think you'd notice that the step-trhough is heavier and probably a bit less stiff, but if you're just pootling around town I'm sure it would be fine.

Pashley website doesn't say what sort of tubing they use, but I'm pretty sure it's good quality steel and will last a long time. Just look at the number of rattly old step-through steel frames still kicking around Edinburgh - they can take it.

Posted 13 years ago #
Smudge
Member

I shouldn't think you'd have any major problems with the lifespan of either frame.
If they were made out of lightweight materiel then yes the Gents would be noticeably stronger simply from an engineering/design perspective. However decent steel joined by brazing by a reputable company, I wouldn't worry personally, and like the old Brit motorcycle frames, in the event a heavy impact (read crash!) ever broke a joint you could always get a decent blacksmith to repair it ;-)

I'd say buy the one whose style you prefer. Of course that would also allow you to comfortably wear a kilt, or follow maninaskirt's example if you're feeling particularly confident ;-))

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

I got a Roadster 26 Sovereign last month so I've done about 500 miles on it now. One of the things I got wrong at first was trying to step through it. I had been using almost nothing but Bromptons since 2001.

Tony Oliver's book on bike frames says that step through frames have less resistance to longitudinal torsion.

My gripes on the Roadster 26 are fairly minimal. It didn't hold in 1st gear for a week but it's fine now. The bell dings on rough roads. I think they should have run the back light off the generator. I'm not keen on the Brooks B72, it's a bit wide and short, so I might swap it for a B17S or B17N.

it gets up all the hills i have to do and isn't as slow as you might expect. It's obviously built for longevity and low maintenance. Even the wheel nuts are domed so that the ends of the axels don't corrode and freeze your nuts.

The built in lock has a captive key. it only comes out when it's locked. This is good because it's always there but it means if you leave it with the key in place some bam could lock it and walk off with the key.

The gear inches are 34.1, 41.0, 54.6, 72.8 and 87.4.

Posted 13 years ago #
LaidBack
Member

Even the wheel nuts are domed so that the ends of the axels don't corrode and freeze your nuts.

That's the kind of comment that non-bike folk just don't appreciate!

34.1, 41.0, 54.6, 72.8 and 87.4.

OK range if you're an experienced cyclist. Some though would look for more under 30 at the expense of top end.
I've had to re-tune the Alfine downwards on an 8 speed Circe tandem for an Aberdeen customer.

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

It would be easy enough to lower the gearing, it's a standard SA sprocket.

I use the top gear a few times a day but I would be happy enough to drop it. My 2 speed Brompton has a 74" top and is a good deal lighter.

The Pashley can get up the steepest hills in Airdrie so I have just left it on the default set up. Yesterday it came home with 4 litres of Sprite Zero in a Carradice Camper Longflap. That's an extra 4 kg for the juice alone and nearly half the weight of the Superlight Brompton.

Posted 13 years ago #
gembo
Member

Your Pashley is buying Sprite Zero, is that good for its teeth?

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

I can't see its teeth, it has a full chain case.

My Brompton M6R enjoyed the new improved version of Metropolis at the weekend but that was the GFT so we had coffee, Green & Black Maya Gold and Tunnock's Teacakes. The extra footage of Freder's dream worked well. I was surprised at how many tiny cuts had been made. I expected extended sequences but some were a second or so.

Posted 13 years ago #
kaputnik
Moderator

got a Roadster 26 Sovereign last month

Beautiful bike, but what does it tip the scales at?

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

I don't know what the weight is. It feels lighter than my trike but I've never put either on the scales.

Everybody in the shop seemed to think it looked nice and some people were surprised that you can still get Edwardian bikes. I'm more interested in how well it deals with the winter.

Posted 13 years ago #
ruggtomcat
Member

@gembo is sprite ZERO, i.e. no sugar, so the drivetrain should be fine ;)

Posted 13 years ago #
kaputnik
Moderator

@gembo is sprite ZERO, i.e. no sugar, so the drivetrain should be fine

Think of it less as Sprite Zero and more as weak carbonic acid :)

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

I'm pretty sure carbonic is always a weak acid.

Posted 13 years ago #
Arellcat
Moderator

Even Wikipedia notes that the strength of carbonic acid is not altogether straightforward.

Posted 13 years ago #
gembo
Member

It is not just the carbonic acid that rots your teeth, it is the tiny animals that CocaCola put in their drinks (also Pepsi?) without telling anyone. THey are invisible but we know they are there. No Sugar for sure but still not water (ph7)

Glad the Brompton enjoyed Metropolis at GFT, I always loved the wee bar up the stairs, the new trendy one is nice too.

There was a Brompton half folded in the pupils bike shed at Tynie last week. And a different one (green) at Gorgie Sainsburys - I expect them in Marchmont but they are on the move. There was also a Hummer - small yellow bike weighed 12 tons (cross between a Grifter and a JCB but heavier). We lubed the chain and tightened the nuts on the back wheel which were about to fall off. I know the kid who uses it to get to school and he is grateful that we look out for him in this microscopic way (I suspect sometimes he mostly has to look out for himself)

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

Ahhh... thanks for the reminder. I need to adjust the cones on number 2 son's Revolution Cairn's back wheel.

Posted 13 years ago #
gembo
Member

The cones on the Hummer were crocked, the weight of the bike must be a factor in wearing out parts, it has motorbike style front suspension - there seems to be no reason for it to exist

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

Two of our boys are roughly the same size so, to avoid buying two bikes the same size, I acquired a used Ridgeback from a friend whose kid had outgrown it. It looks OK. I tightened up the brakes and BB and it seems good to go.

The cones were on a year old EBC machine which has only recently started to get any use. They were too tight when it arrived but I may have gone too far. I'll check it again in a week or two.

Both the Ridegback and EBC Revolution Cairn have front suspension. I managed to get around on my Puch roadster and borrowed Commandos or Grifters without benefit of boing boing forks but hey ho.

The same friend also has a smaller girls bike which I considered converting to boy use with a tin of black Hammerite but it seems the girlieness is all pervasive and even Hammerite would be defeated.

Posted 13 years ago #
gembo
Member

Quite hard to find kids bikes now without gratuitous front suspension, quite cool initially, then just soaks up energy then breaks. My eldest has an ancient Universal we inherited from friends who emigrated to Oz. Doesn't look good but goes quite well, no front suss.. Middle one has new apollo - looks good but all components cheap and nasty, but has encouraged him to get out more. The youngest on a BMX with no front wheel connected by a pole to my old Revolution Cave. Short cycle to Currie Kirk yesterday, harvested some very sweet brambles growing over the railway bridge and hanging out into the space under the bridge.

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

There are two 14" wheel bikes in the shed and the Apollo one of them has boing boing forks. The Raleigh one is simpler and probably a better choice.

We have a 16" wheel Apollo Urchin which is perfectly OK. Nice simple single speed bike. Bits were badly adjusted out of the box. I didn't bother waiting for the guy in the shop to build it.

EBC and Ridgeback have Shimano twist grips. I don't think the forks are branded. Adjustable reach brake levers would be good but neither of them have that.

I did consider a Pucky but they are twice the price and kids leave them lying around or lend them to other kids so cheap and tough seemed more important.

If I was doing it all again I'd get a balance bike but I don't remember them being cheap a few years ago and the idea that we managed to learned without one was also a factor.

There were brambles round Strathclyde park yesterday but he wasn't hungry and didn't even want a Calipo from the van.

A kid across the street still has her front forks on backwards. I told her it was wrong but she doesn't seem to bother.

Posted 13 years ago #
gembo
Member

those balance bikes were indeed hundreds of pounds, I also thought they were for people with one child only giving them enough e time, energy and money to go around the new town with little Hector. But I see the other side now that I am trying to be more reasonable.

There is an apollo single speed hanging from a hook in the garage. it has one stakeliser (gembo family pet name). Sturdy frame.

No calipo from the van, is the wean going down with the chickenpox?

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

I'm glad it wasn't my imagination that balance bikes were hugely spendy. They're down to £30-40 now and that's from decent makers like Kettler.

I take off their pedals and go to the top of a small hill but the purpose built balance bikes seem to work better.

He had chicken pox about 5 years ago and then his wee brother got it the following week. That was a fun summer.

Posted 13 years ago #
gembo
Member

yeah that's the brand - kettler, I saw a family in the new town, thought the thing looked good, checked out the price £120 [at the time I wasn't dividing the total by 3. £30-£40 must have switched production to china. glasgow schools on tomorrow? Edinburgh Holiday (you get it next monday???)

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

Kettler balance bike £40 on Amazon:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kettler-Speedy-12-5-Inch-Balance-Bike/dp/B002UXQM34/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=toys&qid=1284926591&sr=8-1

Yes, long weekend next week. You went back later in August. Next summer we start insanely early because of when the last Friday in June is. Have you looked at what happens in April? Easter is in the second half of the month so I don't think the schools have a whole week from the end of March till mid May.

I'd like to sneak a bike trip to Millport in before the winter so it's probably going to be next weekend or never.

Posted 13 years ago #
gembo
Member

Also schools not breaking up til 23rd Dec. I predict some early baths for some s3 boys. Not back til 10th Jan? Enjoy Millport - you getting any talcum powder cigarettes from the joke shop?

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

We go back on Jan 5th I think because of the days moved to Easter.

I haven't got anything out of a Millport trick shop since 1979. Number 2 sone might want a fish supper or I'll take a Trangia and cook on the beach but it depends on the weather.

I have hired tandems from the joke shops but I don't think we need to do that. If the weather gets bad we will leave it till spring.

Posted 13 years ago #
gembo
Member

I used to go to Millport every year for hols, we were probably sitting in the cafe at teh same time. I found out the king was dead there on August 16th 1977, I'd been sent for the Sunday Mail and the rolls so I was the first in the family to know

Posted 13 years ago #
chdot
Admin

For younger viewers -

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/witness/august/16/newsid_3135000/3135363.stm

"I was eight and on holiday with my family at the time. My sister and I had been to get the morning paper and I didn't know why she was crying."

Posted 13 years ago #
wee folding bike
Member

I was 11 and in Saltcoats at my mum's parents house. It's not the sort of thing you forget.

My boys were 4 or 5 before I told them that he was dead.

It was only last weekend when I was listening to Slade and emptying the dishwasher it clicked what Noddy meant when he said:

"And passed the Hound Dog singer's home"

[+] Embed the video | Video Download Get the Flash Video

Text-Link:

HTML-Link:

BB-Code:

Embed:

Posted 13 years ago #

RSS feed for this topic

12 Next »

Reply »

You must log in to post.

// CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum

About This Forum

CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Debate!

Significant difference in frame strength: gents vs ladies?

Reply »

RSS Feeds

Links

Text-Link:
HTML-Link:
BB-Code:
Embed: