@Frenchy - Exactamundo
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
GSR - 1,500 Housing Estate - Planning 6th Nov Deadline
(163 posts)-
Posted 4 years ago #
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Inspired by this thread I rode through the southern underpass today while on State Approved Exercise. The surface is indeed exciting.
Surely a candidate for a section 75 contribution from the developer to resurface, even if the developer doesn't do it themselves.
Spooked a heron fishing in the burn then spent 10 minutes extricating myself from the creepy empty maze that is Edinburgh Park.
Posted 4 years ago # -
@Frenchy et al. I don't hold out much hope that the rough bit of path that @MediumDave experienced will be improved for the final cycle path between the canal and Gogarburn. The developer, I am sure, will choose to interpret 'continues' as meaning that it follows that route, rather than it is included in what they have to build. I think the Reporter recognised this in the report too.
It's entertaining to read that final report and see verbatim cut-and-paste from the submission I wrote three years ago laying out the route and the requirement for it to be usable. I suspect I got crossed off the Murray Estates' Christmas card list around that time...
What we need to do now is collectively hold to account Murray Estates and the successor developers, so that they don't wriggle out of this commitment.
Posted 4 years ago # -
“so that they don't wriggle out of this commitment”
Do you mean ‘legal requirement’ - or has anyone actually accepted the findings?
Posted 4 years ago # -
@chdot So the permission they've been granted includes some conditions (which they accepted at the hearing), which includes the building of a cycle route. So that is a legal requirement and not in doubt.
The problem comes when their definition of an acceptable cycle route meets ours. We will want X, they will want Y (which will no doubt be cheaper than X). We need to make sure they don't get too much of their own way.
Posted 4 years ago # -
So that is a legal requirement and not in doubt.
Ah, Greenroofer - let me introduce you to Section 42 of the Town and Country Planning (Scotland) Act 1997 - "Determination of applications to develop land without compliance with conditions previously attached".
If a developer doesn't really fancy complying with a condition, they can apply to the Council have it removed. The usual approach is to wait to the development is at an advanced stage, argue there is some unforseen issue and ask if the Council would be so kind as to remove this onerous burden.
Applications aren't always successful, but it is an option.
Posted 4 years ago # -
“The problem comes when their definition of an acceptable cycle route meets ours.”
Well yes but no.
Presumably CEC has some sort of say - maybe it’s just in some legislation (and vague with it??)
Morningsider will know.
Perhaps this is where Spokes comes and helpfully encourages developers to do something iconic and world leading (to go with whatever grand greener is in the various hype messages).
Posted 4 years ago # -
@chdot - The approval, which is subject to the conclusion of a legal agreement between the developer and the council on issues including affordable housing, transport etc, is for planning permission in principle. This means that many of the detailed elements of the scheme are yet to be agreed.
Condition 5 attached to the approval requires the developer to submit plans for the cycle path to the Council for final approval. The council should be able to insist on a high quality design, certainly something that meets Edinburgh street design guidance - which is actually pretty good. Is this guaranteed to happen? No - but it should.Is there a requirement for consultation on these detailed designs (part of a process known as "approval of matters specified in conditions"). Again, no. These decisions are almost always made by planning officers and without public consultation. The developer could choose to consult, but that would be unusual.
Posted 4 years ago # -
Worried it might end up something like NCN1 between Dalmeny and South Queensferry, where the signs and direct-looking path leads to weird residential dead-ends.
Posted 4 years ago # -
I got a email from the DPEA this morning and the Scottish Minister's have approved the Garden District site off Gogar Station Road.
"Scottish Ministers’ Decision
5. Scottish Ministers have carefully considered all of the evidence presented and the Reporter’s conclusions. For the reasons given below, Scottish Ministers grant planning permission in principle for the proposed development subject to the conditions set out in the annex to this notice. References to paragraphs in the sections below, unless stated otherwise, are to the Reporter’s report (dated 13 January 2020).
""
5. No development shall take place on the development site until full details of a
scheme of work for provision of the cycle route to and through the development,
starting north of the M8 overbridge on Gogar Station Road, have been submitted to
and approved by the Council. Those works shall thereafter be implemented in full
and be available for use on or before the occupation of the first residential property within the development hereby approved. These details shall:
a) Include a cycle path heading North East across the field immediately to the North
of the M8 overbridge on Gogar Station Road and connecting with the Eastern end of
the Gogar Station Road spur, near the distribution warehouse and continuing from
there over the railway to the Southern Underpass;
b) Include details of connection points from the new route into the existing cycle
networks to the north and south of the site so as to demonstrate how it will provide a genuine alternative to Gogar Station Road, and beyond that, onto RBS Gogarburn (including the RBS Business School); and
c) Demonstrate that there is control over all land required for the worksReason: In order to ensure that there is a suitable means of cycle access to and
through the development site that provides a genuine alternative to Gogar Station
Road prior to the first occupation of any part of that development."Posted 2 years ago # -
Well done to @Greenroofer for his efforts on getting the cycle path built into the conditions.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Full decision available here
Posted 2 years ago # -
Worth noting that the Ember electric coach services between Edinburgh & Dundee that deliver journey times easily as fast as driving & parking, with the prospect in a few months of not having the added costs of entering the LEZ in Edinburgh and Dundee, now 'serve' Edinburgh Airport but avoid the major time penalty of actually using the cul de sac via the main terminal, and stop at the laybys on the A8 by Gogar Station Road, leaving the option of catching the tram or walking/cycling to the Airport
Posted 2 years ago #
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