I know on-line petitions not everyone's thing, but anyway:
Introduce compulsory age-appropriate retesting every 3 years once a driver turns 70
link here
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Debate!
Petition on license retesting
(30 posts)-
Posted 9 years ago #
-
Why not just every three years??
Posted 9 years ago # -
Because apparently driving is a human right now? And imagine how many people would fail!
Posted 9 years ago # -
"Why not just every three years??"
For everyone? Whatever the argument, I just cant see that happen for purely practical reasons.
The system of testing is overloaded - I passed my test in 1985 at West Saville Terrace, and IIRC there were also centres in Joppa, Sighthill (and probably others I cant remember).
But usual Government tactics of selling off the property assets and firing the staff means we are now in a position where there are only two centres serving Edinburgh - Mussleburgh and Currie.
I was just told the waiting list at Currie is shorter - some 12 weeks.............so imagine the chaos if you add hundreds of thousands of other re-tests (just in our area)??
Posted 9 years ago # -
If the cost of the test covers the employment of testers, why don't they employ more staff?
If the cost of the test doesn't cover the cost of testing, then it sounds like the cost of the test needs to go up.
Posted 9 years ago # -
"Picking" on the over 70's seems a little unfair tbh. There may be medical reasons why they should not be driving but then there are probably similar in the general populace. And on a purely data driven metric under 25's should be retested every week or so.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Just read the link, I feel for the guy. But his story is tragically common and the fact that this time it was an older person doesn't mark it out.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I've always thought it should be every 5 years for all drivers.
It wouldn't take long to train sufficient examiners and administrators.
Why do you need actual test centers in this day and age? For my advanced test, I arranged to meet my police examiner at a petrol station near the bypass, and the test started then and there!
Posted 9 years ago # -
My mother's neighbour is in his early 90s and still driving - and really, really shouldn't be. (He recently mistook the accelerator for the brake and "killed" the freezer in his garage). But he refuses to give it up - there have even been "interventions" from folk via the church. But he is sure he's safe. He mostly drives short distances at 15mph - presumably the only reason he's not hurt more than the freezer...
Posted 9 years ago # -
The whole driving test is flawed in any case, as it doesn't eliminate incompetent drivers.
The driving test as it stands is more about enabling as many people as possible to drive.
Any test that can be sat an infinite number of times until passed, and then never taken again, doesn't really prove anything.
Posted 9 years ago # -
eddie_h: yes, I had a uni friend who took around 10 attempts to pass. I was a passenger of his once and never again. He must have passed by luck and should never have been allowed to drive.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Posted 9 years ago #
-
I have also thought about the idea of retesting,and think it ludicrous that we as a society allow people to drive cars so long as they once passed a test. Maybe it is because 90% of people think they are a better than average driver [1] which must obviously be false!
The photographic licence cards n ed to be renewed every 10 years, so maybe it is time we brought in compulsory retesting before you can get a new one.
Or alternatively, and this might be easier to introduce, a scheme to lower insurance premiums for those who take an optional retest (or raise them for those who dont!)
[1] Bathurst, J., Walton, D. (1998) “An Exploration of the Perceptions of the Average Driver’s Speed Compared to Perceived Driver Safety and Driving Skill.” Accident Analysis and Prevention, 30, 821-30 (and others)
Posted 9 years ago # -
It may not be obvious but 90% of people could be better than average drivers but that doesn't make them good drivers it just makes the average driver very bad.
Of course if you simply rate drivers in a black and white scale of obeys traffic law or not I suspect you would find over 90% rating below average.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Mean, mode or median? :P
One problem with the idea of re-tests is that it presupposes bad driving stems from a lack of familiarity with the law or literal inability to control a vehicle, etc.
This is very similar to the plaintive cry that if only cyclists had to take a test, they'd suddenly realise that traffic is supposed to stop at red lights.
Many of us would agree that has almost nothing to do with a lack of familiarity with the legal setup, and I personally suspect that hardly any bad driving is associated with the lack of regular re-tests.
If passing the test made you more likely to drive safely, you certainly wouldn't expect to see higher insurance premiums for new drivers, which is actually the case.
As a small but important caveat, I do believe we should be massively piling on the pressure for medical staff and DVLA to communicate so that people who are blacking out ten times a day etc. aren't blithely able to continue driving - but that's still not a re-test issue.
Posted 9 years ago # -
:P 90% of drivers think of themselves as better than mean. But is that arithmetic, geometric, or another type of mean?
I can see what you are suggesting regarding retesting, however I think we need to be very careful about putting requirements on medics to report conditions as it plays with patient confidentiality and could put people off seeking treatment.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Some aspects of testing cover the physical actions of the driver, don't they - mirror-checking and head-turning and so on? Mirroring and signalling prior to manoeuvring? Actually stopping at stop lines, interpreting "GIVE WAY" signs/markings correctly rather than as "change down a gear, dab the brake lightly and look over your shoulder after starting the turn"...
Posted 9 years ago # -
Many of us would agree that has almost nothing to do with a lack of familiarity with the legal setup, and I personally suspect that hardly any bad driving is associated with the lack of regular re-tests.
I am not so sure about that. I know that small experiments have been done where drivers get retested and almost all of them fail. They even did it on the One Show once. All of them were surprised because they all thought they were wonderful drivers..
Posted 9 years ago # -
But most folk would be able to reign it in for a test, especially if they had 3-5-10 years notice.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Reign in what? They are practically perfect in every way. Don't forget they have spent those 3/5/10 years telling themselves what an amazing driver they are.
Posted 9 years ago # -
In the USA, in the states I held licences in anyway, it was a 10 year re-licencing system, you just had to take a pretty perfunctory written test - BUT it's better than nothing, and provided a regular revenue stream for state governments.
Sure there would be an uproar, but drivers would have to toe the line if they wanted to drive, and new drivers would just accept the status quo as they wouldn't know anything different. It's not like it's a never-before-heard-of radical concept.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Yes, even a written test would re-educate people on certain aspects of the highway code which wouldn't be a bad thing!
Posted 9 years ago # -
Don't forget they have spent those 3/5/10 years telling themselves what an amazing driver they are.
Mainly brought about by a lack of negative feedback. If 999 times out of 1000 nothing terribly much ever happens when you drive from A to B, you're likely as not woefully unprepared for the 1 time out of 1000 that it does happen, and because of its rarity and the sum of your prior experiences you invariably ascribe it to external circumstances.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I think we need to be very careful about putting requirements on medics to report conditions as it plays with patient confidentiality and could put people off seeking treatment.
It's true, a balance needs to be sought and I'm not sure exactly what it should be. I would have thought actuaries (or equivalent) would be able to balance the difference in QALYs lost to the patients and RTC victims though. After all, effectively the same calculation is made when we work out whether to treat people at all (or in what order) for all sorts of stuff...
Posted 9 years ago # -
I don't think that retesting would cut out the simply bad drivers, those who can do it for the test and then go back to normal as it were.
The tests these days are much more involved than they used to be, I.E a lot of older people will have passed when there was no hazard perception test or when half the road signs didn't exist :-) It would force people to brush up on things they haven't had to learn before.
I think as well, that things like checking eyesight to drive and simply being physically capable is important and the tests usually look for that as well. I think that it is a good idea to have to retake it or you don't get your license renewed.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Even doing only the Driver Theory test once every 10 years would improve standards, lots of drivers out there, who have never taken this test.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I'm slightly troubled by the move to retest elderly drivers automatically, although I can understand where it comes from. Problem is that it comes from the similar idea that talks of licensing cyclists because of the very few genuinely nuisance and dangerous ones out there.
Statistics show that elderly drivers aren't a greater risk, but on the other hand, young and recently licenced drivers are. Maybe there should be a move for new drivers to go through a provisional period, and then be retested before getting a full licence. Failure at the retest stage would mean going back to square one.
As for elderly and all other drivers, I think some kind of periodic health check would be beneficial, but there are confidentiality issues. Maybe a start could be made with public service drivers.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I would not target specific age groups, consider that all age groups should be retested in some manner. Whilst anecdotal, majority of my brushes with poor driving are in the middle age band.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Perhaps we just need to retest anyone who buys a BMW*
On a more serious side would the confidentiality issues remain if the health check was a requirement of maintaining your licence rather than doctors having to report ailments which you go to them with.
*Or other German marque of choice.
Posted 9 years ago # -
"
A teenager caused a fatal car crash in which a woman died just 11 days after he passed his driving test.
"
Posted 9 years ago #
Reply
You must log in to post.
posts
