CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Debate!
"Volvo's Silent Electric Bus Will Now Detect Pedestrians And Honk At Them"
(23 posts)-
Posted 8 years ago #
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Not sure why we need to reinvent the ding ding used by trams, and some buses, already.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Wow,
This just seems wrong on so many levels. Even worse than the life paint stuff.If they come up behind you they'll ping and then honk at you until you move over. I can only hope they warning in the driver's cab is just as obnoxious.
"It also sounds an alert inside the cab, along with a flashing light, to wake up the driver." I'm guessing that's not Volvo's official press release wording.
Posted 8 years ago # -
This just seems wrong on so many levels. Even worse than the life paint stuff.
I think your a trifle overreacting here, I suspect this is in response to pedestrian groups worry that electric vehicles are too quiet and represent "silent death". Haven't you ever had to shout to a phone bound ped as they step in front of you on the bike? Same issue really.
There are a lot of suggestions out there to try and highlight the presence of an electric vehicle to an ever distracted pedestrian population. One was to just play engine noise through a speaker which is also a bit daft since it negates one of the benefit of EV's of reducing the over powering noise in cities. There are others which generate white noise but I suspect this will be filtered out too easily. The bell on the tram is probably the least obnoxious option though perhaps they should have got a scaled up brass bicycle bell.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Bells do seem like a much better option for just letting people at the side of the road that a vehicle is there. Even when rung repeatedly, the tram one doesn't project the same aggression as a horn. If electric vehicles do have to make noise, I'd rather it were that.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Maybe the bus should play chimes like an icecream van.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Electric vehicles should have speakers that make a swooshing noise as they move. You know, like in the films.
Posted 8 years ago # -
It's the automation rather than the noise which annoys me. If the driver was triggering the noise whe thinking there is a need it wouldn't be nearly as objectionable. Unless the software is smart enough to know when the human has a right to be in front of the bus and applies the brakes, although perhaps the software should be applying the brakes anyway.
Posted 8 years ago # -
I've not read up on this particular system but given the technology exists to drive a car on the road with out human intervention I'm quite sure ringing a bell or sounding a horn would be a fairly trivial matter.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Comedy bells should be fitted to all motor vehicles - to make them realise how absurd and out of place they are in a city.
Posted 8 years ago # -
This is the same Volvo who were tweeting a few months back asking people for their opinions on whether self-driving cars should protect their occupants at all costs including at the expense of the lives of other road users. i.e. the decision making logic avoid crashing into the lamp post by running over a pedestrian or avoids an incoming rear-end shunt by changing lanes into a cyclist.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Maybe electric cars should constantly announce their speed, louder and more obnoxiously the faster they're going.
And the horn should be replaced my a whiny man saying "get out of my wayyyyy."
Posted 8 years ago # -
The ethics of how to program a self-driving car to respond to an unavoidable collision are quite fascinating.
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/542626/why-self-driving-cars-must-be-programmed-to-kill/
"
Should it minimize the loss of life, even if it means sacrificing the occupants, or should it protect the occupants at all costs? Should it choose between these extremes at random?
""
Who would buy a car programmed to sacrifice the owner?
"Posted 8 years ago # -
The 'ethics' choices are mostly fallacy as a self driving car, particularly a networked one, will be making more defensive driving decisions, more accurately than any human currently does.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Even humans cannot correctly make complex ethical decisions in the few milliseconds they might have to decide before a crash.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Even humans cannot correctly make complex ethical decisions in the few milliseconds they might have to decide before a crash.
Humans don't make complex ethical decisions in a few milliseconds they'll struggle to make any concious thought in a few seconds let a lone a few milliseconds. Instinct kicks in and self preservation is the automatic attempt. A computer on the other hand could analyse a great many scenarios in the time it takes the driver to realise they might be in trouble and put their phone down.
Realistically, these scenarios are just smoke. Any ethical programming decisions will have to be dictated by policy makers before the vehicles are licensed. Frankly I'm not any more worried by an autonomous vehicle driving over me than I am by a fully attentive squishy driver never mind the ones who currently pilot vehicles.
Posted 8 years ago # -
@Steveo, the only thing I have to go on is this article and the linked Volvo press release, here's some snippets from it.
"If there is an imminent risk of an incident, the bus’s horn is activated.""In order to minimize the risks, it is important that drivers and anyone moving around near buses—such as at bus stops and pedestrian crossings—pays close attention to the traffic."
"...the new system will be unveiled together with several other Volvo safety innovations, such as Volvo Dynamic Steering, Collision Warning and Emergency Braking and Lane Keeping Support."
"Consists of a camera, image-processing system and algorithms for detection of pedestrians and cyclists. Driver alert with light and sound signals. External synthetic background sound, amplifier and speaker."
There is no mention of capability for this system to use the emergency braking when it detects an imminent collision, rather it will honk at the pedestrian in a "Ger off my land" kind of way.
I should mention that I like the idea of the vehicles operating silently unless there are people in the vicinity of it, I just object to the honking at pedestrians when it has failed to be operated sensibly.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Badly worded PR aside, Volvo (and others) have emergency brake tech on the road. I don't see why they'd not apply it to a bus that already has a collision warning system (internal and external) in place.
Posted 8 years ago # -
I'd be stunned if a system put in place to honk at pedestrians was not also linked to a system that applied the brakes, especially given the systems to apply the brakes automatically have been in existence for years, with Volvo being one of the main drivers (pun intended) behind that, while the honking is a very new 'innovation'.
And if the 'Emergency Braking' mentioned in the blurb is not part of the collision detection system then exactly what is the Emergency Braking system?
In short it would be an idiotic system that had emergency braking capability, that bypassed that, and honked a horn instead; and even more idiotic to mention emergency braking systems in a press release, then not activate them.
Or in other words, I think you're reading into the statement what you want to see acsimpson!
Posted 8 years ago # -
As far as I'm aware the only death caused by an autonomous car was of the driver.
I struggle to imagine a scenario where a (sensibly driven) car is going fast enough to unavoidably kill it's occupants and suddenly finding itself with ten innocent pedestrians in front of it. As Klaxon says I'm more likely to kill myself when driving than an autonomous car ever would be.
I suspect the decision will come down to commercials at the end of the day and no car will be programmed to drive itself off a cliff to avoid a collision with a bystander, they might however decide to drive into a hedge or other survivable soft feature.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Just realised my last post ignored you comments Steve and WC. I hope and suspect your right. I'm sure their legal team has too much sense to let them honk and not break.
Posted 8 years ago # -
This seems to be a thing at the moment:
Humans mistaken for seats
and seats mistaken for humans
Posted 7 years ago # -
http://www.comingsoon.net/movies/news/595362-car-seat-cameraman-behind-scenes-raid-2-car-chase-scene
(Warning: the 'And here’s the full chase sequence…' clip is violent.)
Posted 7 years ago #
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