CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » General Edinburgh

Today's rubbish sentencing

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  1. crowriver
    Member

    Unfortunately, Sheriff Alastair Carmichael has form in cases such as this. Is he a keen motoring enthusiast perchance? I think we should be told. See upthread:

    https://stv.tv/news/north/1429340-woman-who-ran-over-children-outside-mcdonald-s-avoids-jail/

    Posted 4 months ago #
  2. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    I don't even know if this is rubbish or not. Eight weeks of unpaid work?

    Posted 4 months ago #
  3. steveo
    Member

    banned from driving for 10 years.

    Would prison make things better in this case? The driver doesn't appear to be a serial offender and a ten year ban is pretty hefty by comparison.

    Posted 4 months ago #
  4. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    Would prison make things better in this case?

    No. Certainly not. Restorative justice is surely the thing, I just wondered about the amount of it and the quality.

    Posted 4 months ago #
  5. Frenchy
    Member

    I don't think that's a rubbish sentence.

    Posted 4 months ago #
  6. Frenchy
    Member

    Don't know if this has been posted already but an interesting programme about the CPS and their treatment of a careless / dangerous driving case.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b071gvs3/the-prosecutors-real-crime-and-punishment-1-the-charge

    Watched this this morning. Very interesting.

    Posted 4 months ago #
  7. morepathsplease
    Member

    Watched this this morning. Very interesting.

    I watched that also and found it quite moving at the end. Lots of interesting aspects but it also gave me the impression that, at the end of the day, road crime is treated as 'not proper crime' by the CPS.

    Posted 4 months ago #
  8. edinburgh87
    Member

    Daily Mail alert - I'll admit to not knowing the full story but the way the driver has been transposed into a victim in the below has really wound me up

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6573281/Lorry-driver-breaks-tears-death-Queens-doctor.html

    Posted 1 month ago #
  9. Greenroofer
    Member

    @edinburgh87 I thought that article was surprisingly balanced for the Daily Mail. In some ways the driver is a victim: there was no suggestion that she was unfit to drive (unlike many similar cases) and I can certainly envisage a situation where a bike and rider can end up in the driver's blind spot through no fault of the driver and there's nothing the driver can do to avoid that. The driver is, quite rightly, devastated and I feel for her in a way that I don't for the drivers who knowingly take to the road in big lorries while unfit through drink, drugs, exhaustion or whatever, and who deserve to go to jail for a long time.

    Ultimately the fault lies with those in power who allow big lorries to be on the same road as people on bikes.

    I do take issue with the article referencing the fact that the victim was wearing a helmet. That is totally irrelevant to this article about being driven over by a lorry, but that's a point for another thread.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  10. Stickman
    Member

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/jail-for-student-who-killed-doctor-on-zebra-crossing-in-tulse-hill-after-failing-to-clear-frost-from-a4038441.html

    Uninsured driver who didn’t clear his windscreen kills a woman on a zebra crossing: careless driving, 10 months in jail, 23 month ban from driving.

    Posted 1 month ago #
  11. Stickman
    Member

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-46945366

    “A truck driver who crashed head-on into a BMW killing a 55-year-old man has been ordered to carry out community service. Ronald Bridges, 59, crashed into Michael Laverty's car after overtaking a car which was slowing down to turn right.

    Judge Lady Stacey ordered him to perform 150 hours of unpaid work in the community and banned him from driving for four years.

    "This is a tragedy. This was caused by a momentary inattention on your part. Drivers have a duty to be vigilant on the road."
    Lady Stacey said that, in the circumstances, a jail sentence was not necessary.“

    Posted 1 month ago #
  12. Frenchy
    Member

    Strictly speaking, perhaps "rubbish charging" rather than "rubbish sentencing".

    https://metro.co.uk/2019/01/30/son-wealthy-couple-killed-two-audi-crash-cant-name-8416176

    17 year old sentenced to two years supervision order, a £105 fine and banned from driving for two years after killing two pedestrians whilst driving after smoking cannabis.

    The sentence was for the cannabis bit, not the killing pedestrians bit.

    "He was not accused of any offences in relation to the deaths of pedestrians John Shackley and Jason Imi."

    Magistrate: "However, there are no charges in relation to the standard of your driving on that day."

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  13. ejstubbs
    Member

    Don't think Chris Boardman was impressed with this one:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-47071273

    even if it's just the terminology ("careless" vs "dangerous") which sticks in his craw.

    Could also be regarded, as Frenchy's example, as rubbish charging. It does seem sometimes that the DPP is a bit over-eager to accept the trade-off of a guilty plea to a lesser charge vs the time & money required to secure a meaningful conviction for a more serious offence. If the accused is prepared to admit that they were committing a summary offence (in this case, it appears Mr Rosney admits he was using his phone while driving) then that should significantly reduce the chances of getting away with the "careless" charge.

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  14. Frenchy
    Member

    I don't know the facts of the case but

    "Carol Boardman, 75, died in July 2016 after she fell off her bike in Deeside"

    strikes me as probably being rubbish journalism as well.

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  15. Frenchy
    Member

    strikes me as probably being rubbish journalism as well.

    Sentence has now been amended to:

    "Carol Boardman, 75, was hit in July 2016 after she fell off her bike in Deeside, Flintshire."

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  16. gembo
    Member

    The perp actually going to jail, even if for 33 weeks well 16.5 weeks seems small for taking someone's life. Yet I am surprised he went down.

    Posted 2 weeks ago #
  17. steveo
    Member

    https://www.runnersworld.com/uk/news/a26285031/driver-jailed-after-mowing-down-runner-training-for-london-marathon/

    Apparently it is possible to get a conviction for dangerous driving, sentence is longer but still barely appropriate for what are likely life changing injuries.

    Posted 1 week ago #

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