CityCyclingEdinburgh was launched on the 27th of October 2009 as "an experiment".
IT’S TRUE!
CCE is 15years old!
Well done to ALL posters
It soon became useful and entertaining. There are regular posters, people who add useful info occasionally and plenty more who drop by to watch. That's fine. If you want to add news/comments it's easy to register and become a member.
RULES No personal insults. No swearing.
Puzzled by rationale for removal being that a permanent scheme is planned?
As I gather, the legal basis for the experimental regulation order is that you have to be experimenting to find something out. If you already have a final layout, it's legally dubious.
Oh, to be a newspaper columnist. Where you can decry helicopter parenting, childhood inactivity, obesity and the death of the local community and at the same time demand that the Council apologise for actually trying to do something about it.
@ M
Thanks for reading it!
“
Edinburgh City Council bosses have renamed Spaces for People as ‘Travelling Safely’, as the social-distancing requirements that were used to justify the schemes are no longer in force.
And while some measures, such as those on George IV Bridge, are set to be scrapped, they are now planning on carrying out more community consultation in other areas over making the measures permanent.
“
Tories demanding that every SfP scheme is ripped out (apart from some around schools).
Debate on Radio Scotland now. Fairly even so far.
can anyone update on what happened?
@SRD: the report was passed as published.
Officers explained that to extend the George IV/Forrest Road scheme would require a Experimental TRO, however that can’t happen because there is already the plan for the permanent scheme. They can’t conduct an experiment on something that has already been agreed.
Sense of huge frustration on the part of Lesley Macinnes, David Key and transport officers. They are being hamstrung by the TRO process.
Tories wanted everything ripped up. The only thing I agreed with them about was the length of time to get agreed schemes completed (crossing at Arboretum Place was specifically mentioned).
Lesley was taking none of their **** today.
Latest “thinking” from the council.
Utterly inept.
https://drscottarthur.scot/2021/09/14/update-braid-comiston-road-spaces-for-people-scheme-review
The Council appears to be considering allowing parking in the cycle lanes: “it is proposed to remove the Loading restrictions along most of the length of the scheme, and provide gaps in the cycle lane defenders where possible, to provide additional loading opportunities.”
@Stickman - thanks. Even madder than it first seems! The PowerPoint slides attached to your link state:
We are aware of issues regarding loading and unloading access along stretches of Comiston Road – especially Buckstone Terrace – with limited parking availability.
There are very few houses on Buckstone Terrace and, as far as I can see, all but one has a private driveway. Majestic Wine, Charwood and the BT building all have private parking. The Buckstone shops have free, on-street parking. So it can't be for the benefit of residents or local businesses.
Are the Council really going to rip up the cycle lane to save DPD/Hermes etc. drivers from walking 50m from the nearest parking space or side street?
From my observation, the main abusers of the Comiston Road cycle lanes/parking restrictions have been tradespeople working at the various private houses along that road (I count roughly 40+ along Buckstone Terrace, from the Fairmilehead lights to the Braid Road junction - not what you'd call high density I agree, but it seemed to be sufficient to require quite enough tradespeoples' vehicles to be illegally parked as to make the cycle lane annoyingly inconvenient and unpleasant to use). This despite, as you say, many/most of said properties having private drives - an issue which has been discussed not so long ago elsewhere on this forum (might even have been earlier on this very thread).
And let's not forget that before first lockdown the south end of Buckstone Terrace was a de facto unofficial park and ride served by the number 11 bus. Take away the parking restrictions and the northbound cycle lane from the Fairmilehead lights to Caiystane Crescent and likely beyond will no doubt be thick with parked cars once more.
Based on the above, if they remove the parking/waiting restrictions along Comiston Road then I reckon the cycle lanes will quickly become next to useless and might as well be taken out - which could very well by why this idea is being mooted. But hey, drivists absolutely have to be able to abandon their vehicles as close as possible to their intended destination, don't they? Er...
None of this would even be being suggested if parking in mandatory cycle lanes was actually illegal, as all logic says it should be (IIRC the history of how that managed not to be the case is also discussed elsewhere on CCE). As it is we're left with the same nonsense logic that means it's not [yet] illegal to park on the footway, despite the fact that to park on the footway one has pretty much has to drive on the footway, which definitely is illegal, and by all rational argument the simple presence of a vehicle parked on the footway would seem to be prima facie evidence of the offence of driving on the footway having been committed.
Lanark Road lanes, when blocked, are inevitably blocked by tradesmen or the odd supermarket van. I must say that I've been amazed how clear they have been (considering there's a twitter account that just tweets hundreds of cars and vans that illegally park all day on the pedestrianized Cockburn street right in the centre of town!)
For all that, they aren't blocked enough for it to be a big deal in my opinion. I would say the average day there are no obstructions, but even if there were two or three, it would still be viable over what was there before.
What they are proposing on Comiston rd is a complete betrayal of the so-called climate crisis or public health priorities. It makes my blood boil.
I saw a car (or might have been a van) parked in the Comiston Road cycle lane literally right next to a parking space. Had I been on the bike I would have stopped and asked the driver to move it, but I was a passenger in a vehicle and so could do nothing about it.
Broader point - one of the many beliefs we need to challenge is "people should be allowed to abandon their cars wherever they like".
@,fimm. This is what the SfP challenges. The politicians have caved. People must be allowed to park where they like. On corners - what is the problem, there is no double yellow.
Yesterday the entire painted cycle lane at Tills Bookshop which has double yellow lines had liveried vehicles parked in the lane. A prominent independent off licence I spotted. I shall not name and shame as of course this lane also has a completely separate segregated lane next to it. Which I have also spotted vans parked upon. (The kerb). I think there is a cafe for the white van drivers across from Tills.
At the overpaid end of the spectrum, you see cars parked all day with tickets. Their owner not bothered about the fine.
In better news the professional golfer Mark Calchevecchia once took his clubs on the train to a tournament in Holland. And several of the pro cyclists are cycling home at the end of the Vuelta or the Tour.
One of the Stans in Central Asia had a premier who drove his tank over poorly parked vehicles?
Surely just put loading bays in the side roads replacing a few parking spaces?
Idea that we need less driving really does not seem to have sunk in. Hopefully we get a green surge next CEC election
@gembo, that was the Mayor of Vilnius, Lithuania. So more Baltic than Eurasia. Also it was an APC rather than a tank.
Viddo:
“Idea that we need less driving really does not seem to have sunk in.“
Even at SG which has a 20% mileage reduction policy and a small section at Transport Scotland thinking about it.
Notions are that ‘behaviour change’ will work with almost no sticks and fewer carrots.
@crowriver, excellent corrections
@toomanybikes you cannot park round the corner as you are not paying the parking fee you are chancing it, so you have to park out the front which has the added advantage of not having to walk anywhere
I've seen a few people on twitter highlighting that there are now places in the world where the relevant authority has created an app that any resident can install on their phone that allows them to go through a short process to report any illegal parking and similar offences they witness by simply clicking a button and taking a couple of geotagged pictures. Not only that, but once the images have been reviewed the app will update you on the actions taken so you know you're not just screaming into the void.
Christ just imagine how much of a difference that could make here - assuming they actually pulled the finger out and brought the pavement parking legislation forward, including bike lanes in it, and streamlined the process for fining people.
@Yodhrin - it used to be possible (in England anyway) for Councils to use mobile ANPR enabled CCTV cameras for parking enforcement. All a parking attendant had to do was drive around in a suitably equipped car/scooter and the fines would be issued automatically. It was simply too effective and the Tory/Lib Dem coalition (specifically Eric Pickles) banned it:
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-bans-use-of-cctv-spy-cars-for-on-street-parking
It's not that we can't do it, it's that we choose not to.
We the media need to get over the idea that these fines are a tax on the motorist. They are not they are a tax on laziness/disobedience/etc.
I lost count of the number of times I reported a van being completely parked over the pavement in my mother's street. Putting aside the pavement parking ban it is a clear case of obstruction as no-one can use the pavement.
Was the guy ever prosecuted? No, Police Scotland decided to warn him (at least 5 times!) - is it that hard to enforce the law. I suspect that even when the law comes in they will continue with this very lax/lazy attitude.
@acsimpson, "They are not they are a tax on laziness/disobedience/etc." Ah, but that is a tax on the motorist. Boom! Boom! (Basil Brush style laughter).
@wishicouldgofaster, "...even when the law comes in..." The new law actually legalises pavement parking for "up to 20 minutes" (sorry, I meant "loading") so I very much doubt any enforcement will be possible/practical. It's not so much a loophole as a yawning chasm where the proverbial coach and horses will not only be driven through but also parked up on the footway for "up to 20 minutes"... Just like that! (Tommy Cooper style laughter).
@Morningsider, "It's not that we can't do it, it's that we choose not to." Less of the "we" please. They, it's they who are doing this to "us".
The majority of Glasgow SfPs to stay as independent stud6 finds they are beneficial.
Well, well well. The Scotsman lets the cat out of the bag:
The Maison Bleue owner said his 25-year-old Victoria Street restaurant has been “saved” as a result of the Spaces for People scheme enabling him to have a terrace to host guests.The Edinburgh restaurateur recently received confirmation the terrace will now remain in place until December 31, which he said would be a “godsend” to his business.
Need to retweet this. Brexit and pandemic close half business but the other half saved by SFP
Now adding this place to potential restaurants to go to.
The Morningside restaurant was great the couple of times that I've been there. That article should probably be posted on the Brexit thread too, since Mr Gabassi seems to lay the blame for his staffing and cost issues squarely there.
And he's not the only one: Fred Berkmiller, the chef patron of L'Escargot Bleu on Broughton Street blamed staffing issues amongst other things for having to give up the take away service that kept them* going through lockdown, the limited opening hours in the re-opened Broughton Street restaurant, and fact that his L'Escargot Blanc restaurant on Queensferry Street is remaining closed for the foreseeable future. And one of his suppliers of organic veg is equally scathing about the difficulties it is creating in recruiting seasonal labour, and the costs it already adding to the importation of fresh foodstuffs even before the full gamut of border control measures are finally implemented (if they ever are).
* And us!
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