@Frenchy, yes, you're right, I think, it does go to Murdoch Terrace. So really just the one block that's left unsegregated, but the most important one on that stretch.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
Scottish Govmt announces £10m for pop up cycle/walking lanes
(3661 posts)-
Posted 3 years ago #
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@chdot: "For clarification, the Greenbank to Meadows measures do not include the closure of Braid Road..."
My understanding is that a number of modal filters at the south end of the Greenbank-Meadows QR were removed from the QR plan because the Braid Road closure made them (largely) unnecessary. I can't now find where that was stated, maybe on the Spokes page? I've certainly seen (but now cannot find*) an earlier version of the QR plan with modal filters at the junction of Braid Road with Cluny Gardens, as well as elsewhere south of that junction. So while the Braid Road closure may not be part of the QR plan, it's closely integrated with it, in that if the closure is removed, the QR plan would have to revert to its original form. The current QR plan does clearly show the Braid Road closures as "existing modal filters".
So to my mind the "clarification" from the SfP team is more than a little disingenuous. (I sincerely hope that the QR isn't going to end up being a failure because of turf wars between different factions within the SfP team.)
* Why does there appear to be no easy to find central repository of the documentation on this stuff, like there is for planning applications? I can understand it being OK for people to be made aware of these things via Twitter, local news etc but having to trawl through each tweeted/announced/leaked snippet does not in my view contribute to local democracy.
Posted 3 years ago # -
@ejstubbs - here's the original plans confirming what you say. It is indeed correct the southern most filters were removed because Braid road was to remain shut (as I stated above).
Posted 3 years ago # -
Agreed that it's a pain keeping track of latest information, you basically have to check the meeting page for the latest Transport Meeting.
e.g. re on point on interventions coming back if Braid Road reopened, you'd have to look at https://democracy.edinburgh.gov.uk/documents/s26614/7.1%20-%20Spaces%20for%20People%20East%20Craigs%20Low%20Traffic.pdf in section 4.2.5
At its southern end the QR runs along Hermitage Drive between Braid Road and Hermitage Gardens. With Braid Road closed this link is lightly trafficked, however, were Braid Road opened this would be likely to require further intervention to ensure it was safe.
Posted 3 years ago # -
@algo: Thanks for that. It's clear that I was mistaken about the location of the modal filters on the original QR plan. With those in place as per the QR plan, and Braid Road re-opened, the rat run to Morningside Station avoiding Comiston Road would involve going round three sides of a rectangle (Hermitage Drive-Hermitage Gardens-Braid Crescent). I'm not sure whether that would be enough of an inconvenience to enough drivers to keep the traffic volumes on that route adequately under control. And it would do nothing to dissuade drivers from using the Midmar Drive-Hermitage Drive rat run to Buckstone Terrace from Cluny Gardens avoiding Morningside Station, which IMO was at least as busy as Braid Road used to be between Morningside Station and the Hermitage.
It's a bit disappointing that the one way eastbound for motor vehicles on Braidburn Terrace (which was in plan even before SfP got under way) isn't marked on either version of the QR plan. It seems to be a fairly key element of the Greenbank end of the route. That said, I've certainly seen a lot more vehicles turning right from Comiston Road on to Braidburn Terrace than used to be the case before the Braid Road closure; clearly the Midmar rat run still 'works' in that direction for enough folks.
Posted 3 years ago # -
the Midmar Drive-Hermitage Drive rat run to Buckstone Terrace from Cluny Gardens
My old boss used to do that twice a day.
Posted 3 years ago # -
@ejstubbs - good points - I and others from Spokes have made this point about the Midmar Drive rat run in the Community Council meetings, still favouring the Braid Road closure as integral to the plans.
However - from a PR perspective - some folk were keen to dissociate the Quiet Route from the Braid Road closure as it was so emotive particularly to the South Morningside congestion which many have been persuaded is due to the BR closure. It's been tricky as all of us want to see *something* being done, but equally I totally get that watering stuff down is often worse than doing nothing...
Thankfully I'm not a politician, but if I were I'd be rubbish.
Posted 3 years ago # -
@algo: To your knowledge, has anyone made any observations about the congestion that seems to arise due to the apparently haphazard phasing of the lights at the Greenbank Crescent and Greenbank Drive junctions? I know that it's mainly due to the levels of traffic on that corridor but it doesn't help that the light phases don't seem to be at all synchronised between the two junctions, meaning that not infrequently people (including cyclists*) end up waiting at a red light with a green light clearly visible at the next junction up but no-one going through it. Nor is that situation helped by the frequent multiple occupancy of the Braid Burn bus stop between the two junctions.
* Such as the one I observed running the northbound red light at Greenbank Crescent the other day - reprehensible, but understandable to a degree since the road beyond the lights was completely empty and there was an inviting green light at the Greenbank Drive junction.
Posted 3 years ago # -
One could almost make a case for the Braid Road closure on the grounds that it's too dangerous a stretch of road for people to be allowed to drive on. I've certainly seen both the armco and the actual wall behind the petrol station fairly comprehensively demolished more than once, presumably by idiot drivists failing to control their speed properly on the tight, quite steep downhill and slightly off-camber bend northbound.
<removes tongue from cheek>
Posted 3 years ago # -
Incidentally who expects snow and/or ice to be cleared off the closed section of Braid Road?
Not I.
Posted 3 years ago # -
“
As I said, if the community is involved the project is more likely to succeed. This isn't rocket science - there are countless examples of this.
Look at how community engagement improved the Picardy Place plans substantially...
“
https://twitter.com/cllrscottarthur/status/1339984454354350092
Posted 3 years ago # -
And they say satire is dead.
Posted 3 years ago # -
That man needs to leave the public sphere and reflect on his behaviour.
Posted 3 years ago # -
“And they say satire is dead”
I can’t understand whether he thinks PP has been improved compared with earlier plans “substantially” or whether he thinks there was no consultation.
Or
Perhaps
It wasn’t the sort of consultation he approves of.
Whatever.
He has succeeded in making me give up engaging with him on Twitter.
(His loss...)
Posted 3 years ago # -
I can't decide if I want to know the answer.
I probably don't.
Posted 3 years ago # -
I suppose there is a certain populist purity in acclaiming the actions of individual voters whilst refusing to cast a vote as their elected representative.
Posted 3 years ago # -
“I suppose there is a certain populist purity“
VG!
Posted 3 years ago # -
I thought his previous reference to PP must be ironic.
Apparently not.
“
Working with local people to improve designs is recognised as best practice.
Picardy Place is a good example of where that worked.
“
https://twitter.com/cllrscottarthur/status/1340370522962616323
Sometimes I feel I’m in a parallel universe or going mad.
Probably both.
Posted 3 years ago # -
“He has succeeded in making me give up engaging with him on Twitter.“
Oops that didn’t last.
Posted 3 years ago # -
Scott Arthur’s Picardy Place Parallel Universe
Posted 3 years ago # -
But he’s allowed to have a parallel universe - essential for a politician.
Posted 3 years ago # -
Yes of course they all have that but he is in his on his own
Posted 3 years ago # -
PP latest
“
Nonetheless, consultation improved the plans.My blog on it is here:
“
https://twitter.com/cllrscottarthur/status/1340390241371385857
Posted 3 years ago # -
For those who can’t be bothered to skim, this is the key bit -
“
This, and adverse comments from the public, triggered improvements to the design and a further round of public consultations, but the gyratory layout was retained.
“
And he still believes consultations are important before temporary road closures...
Posted 3 years ago # -
Would you look at the sheen on that Richard the Third!
Posted 3 years ago # -
I do agree with him that the design was better following consultation.
I think that says far more about the quality of the plans pre-consultation than it does about how successful and useful the consultation process was.
I disagree that there was "significant" improvement. Certainly nothing worth the time and effort that was put into it by both volunteers and council officers.
Posted 3 years ago # -
@ Frenchy
Agree
Bad: yes
Better: not enough
“nothing worth the time and effort that was put into it by volunteers and council officers”
So true
And worse
If that had been a genuine consultation SOME (more) of all that effort would have been effective.
But even with the involvement of those council staff that actually understood the issues, the deals had already been done.
It was never about ‘cycling’ not really about ‘transport’ - except the fantasies of ‘traffic flow’ (and feeding the absurdly large new car park).
Even without Covid, the shiny shopping palace is likely to become lacklustre quickly and/or suck the commercial life out of much of central Edinburgh.
Posted 3 years ago # -
Been a fun day on Twitter
This is NOT one of my accounts
Posted 3 years ago # -
Five vehicles parked in the new mandatory cycle lanes on Gilmerton Road up from Ellen's Glen. Is that legal, enforceable? No double yellows.
Posted 3 years ago # -
@IWRATS - mandatory cycle lanes without yellows are not enforceable (although they used to be - all quite complicated). Colin Smyth MSP, Labour transport spokesperson, tried to close this loophole through an amendment to the Transport (Scotland) Bill when it was going through the Scottish Parliament a couple of years ago. Failed due to opposition from the SNP and Tories.
Posted 3 years ago #
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