CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Debate!

Today's rubbish driving...

(11251 posts)
  • Started 12 years ago by Stepdoh
  • Latest reply from neddie
  • This topic is sticky

  1. glasgow megasnake
    Member

    It's a very complex question since the answer depends on the precise circumstances. Do I think its ok to break the speed limit on an empty 4 lane motorway? Do I think it's ok to drive at the 30mph speed limit past a busy school at picking out time? no...

    I would argue that the large-scale downgrading of limits (NSL to 50, 30s to 20s) where not always appropriate (though not always inappropriate) has something to do with that. In some places, e.g. Derbyshire, the majority of what were NSL roads are now 50s.

    If you want people to respect speed limits then they have to be justified. It used to be the case that they were set at the 80th percentile of the speed of traffic and that this worked well in terms of having limits that were both credible and likely to be obeyed. The danger in setting speed limits too low is that people will be habituated to ignoring them, particularly those that are unjustified, and then will one day find themselves ignoring a well-justified limit to the detriment of other road users.

    Driving well is all about judgement and situational awareness so there is really no reason why a rigid attitude to speed limit adherence is necessary in a 'good' driver. All that's needed is a mature one.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  2. minus six
    Member

    If you want people to respect speed limits then they have to be justified

    No Man with a Good Car Needs to Be Justified

    Posted 5 years ago #
  3. gembo
    Member

    @glasgow mega snake, there is a paper somewhere on here somewhere from OECD/IRTAD/ITF looking at reductions in speed limits and making the link very strongly to reduction in injuries and fatalities. Though the lowest speed is 50kmh. The paper also looks at increases in speed, e.g. Hungary seems to have increased its speed limits. As you might expect the injuries and fatalities rise. The paper also looks at how much a 10kmh reduction in speed limits impacts on the speed drivers drive ( slower but not the full 10kmh).

    I feel this paper is quite good justification for 20mph. Not perfect because the speed reductions are not that slow. But initial figures suggest a dip in injuries and fatalities following the 20mph limit in Edinburgh conforming to the data in the rest of the paper.

    I shall look around for the link later.

    https://www.itf-oecd.org/sites/default/files/docs/speed-crash-risk.pdf

    Posted 5 years ago #
  4. Stickman
    Member

    This evening I had a close pass from a 4x4 on Morrison St heading towards Haymarket. The driver can't have been paying attention as he then drove into the temporary taxi rank opposite the station (the one signed "Taxis Only").

    He realised his mistake at being stuck behind a row of stationary taxis and reversed back out as I passed him. He then had to wait behind me as I took primary through the roadworks, only to give another big revvy pass at the end. He turned right up Wester Coates Rd - clearly I was holding him up for the last 300 metres of his journey.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  5. ARobComp
    Member

    https://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/news/local-news/tractor-driver-who-misjudged-overtaking-1504500

    100 hours community service, and a 1 year ban, for overtaking a cyclist, in a tractor, on a blind bend, and pulling in too early and killing him... Then not realising you'd hit them, and driving on...

    Also the judge said this was “An error of judgment other drivers would have made”

    Oh well that' s ok then.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  6. dougal
    Member

    Maybe these other drivers should lose their licenses too, before they kill someone? Seems the only reasonable conclusion.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  7. Rob
    Member

    @ARobComp don't forget speeding - "as they approached a right hand bend at about 30mph". Tractors limited to 25.

    One from this morning:

    Posted 5 years ago #
  8. Frenchy
    Member

    Overtaken twice whilst doing 22mph on Niddrie Mains Road (speed limit 20mph) last night - once immediately before a pinch point and once by a driver who turned left 3s later.

    The driver of a fire engine behind me then turned the siren on (very briefly) whilst I was waiting to enter a roundabout. Fair enough, but they were quite happy to then sit silently behind motorised road users.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  9. Stickman
    Member

    Yesterday lunchtime I was heading along Wester Coates in the outside lane as I was heading straight along Roseburn Terrace (and the inside lane was full of parked cars). Lights ahead were red, but that didn't stop a Royal Mail van overtaking me in order to then pull into the left-turn lane. I got to the lights a second later and pulled up right beside him, before heading off as he waited for the green left-turn light.

    Utterly, utterly pointless MGIF.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  10. Rob
    Member

    Cruising for a parking space, not paying attention to the red light/crossing?

    [+] Embed the video | Video DownloadGet the Video Widget

    Some fun from yesterday's: https://twitter.com/srs_autoparts/status/839481575775617024

    Posted 5 years ago #
  11. jdanielp
    Member

    Yikes. Just experienced some of the worst driving/behaviour in a while as I cycled to a friend's place. Several close passes as I cycled at around 20 mph heading down Fountainbridge, and then much hooting and revving by a van driver on Stevenson Drive as I diverted around the closed off park.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  12. chdot
    Admin

  13. GDR
    Member

    This afternoon. Going round Arthur’s Seat. Beautiful afternoon. 4 or 5 lovely vintage (1930s ?) open topped cars. BUT driven by total idiots. Raced up behind me and insisted on squeezing past at speed rather than wait till Icould pull into the passing place which was all of 20 yards ahead. Shouted at one pair of pillocks kitted out in full Dick Dastardly leather helmets but suspect they did not hear. Felt like they were actually in some kind of race.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  14. mcairney
    Member

    Technically yesterday's rubbish driving but I nearly got wiped out by a parked van pulling out (without indicating or checking his mirrors) while I was alongside it on Forrest Road. I may have subjected him to a torrent of choice language as a result of this near-death experience!

    In the meantime I'll be avoiding that stretch as it's jinxed (last week I did a classic SPD topple when I came to a halt and couldn't unclip at Greyfriar's Bobby).

    Posted 5 years ago #
  15. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    Hope Park Terrace to Salisbury Place junction is mayhem these days. Horns a-peeping, motors a-revving, yellow boxes totally ignored, folk flying around in all directions.

    Still, QBiC.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  16. gembo
    Member

    Big diesel spill all through West Port where the lay by has sand in it and on through Grassmarket and Cowgate. Take care as car drivers not really aware of this. Rain might clear it though.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  17. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    Ah yes. Diesel on the turn from South Clerk Street into Hope Park Terrace and all round Charlotte Square.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  18. gembo
    Member

    Must be Diesel Day?

    Posted 5 years ago #
  19. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    Edinburgh Festival of Diesel 1st to 8th May.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  20. Rothar
    Member

    Small VW van (white, no markings) - SL18 FWD - pulled out in front of me as I was going around the roundabout at the Royal Mile/Scottish Parliament.

    Driver and passenger shout obscenities and give two finger waves. I don't think they appreciated my "Oi! You give way to the right!" call.

    Anyway, happy and safe Thursday, everyone!

    Posted 5 years ago #
  21. wingpig
    Member

    K66 NWH, liveried in the NWH Road Menace colour scheme, following a colleague through the pinch points on Milton Road West on Monday morning without thinking that they'd be much pinchier by the time they got to them, given my continued forward motion.

    Not the two ambulances who came right up behind me before parping their sirens on King's Haugh this morning, but the nerk in the SUV who seemed dismayed that I moved out of the second ambulance's path, possibly costing him ten seconds.

    Oncoming-traffic-ignoring close-passing SUV on Charterhall Road, whose windows were unfortunately shut when I came past thirty seconds later.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  22. Murun Buchstansangur
    Member

    Re GDR's Arthur's Seat experience - these Toads of Barony Castle?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-south-scotland-43988007

    Posted 5 years ago #
  23. Arellcat
    Moderator

    Big diesel spill all through West Port where the lay by has sand in it and on through Grassmarket and Cowgate.

    I encountered it yesterday morning too, about 8.15 or thereabouts, and it was extensive. I remember it starting at about the Cowgate/Grassmarket junction and all the way to West Port.

    Traffic behaviour, and the sheer excitement of commuting by motorbike, meant I'd forgotten all about it by the time I reached Fountainbridge.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  24. urchaidh
    Member

    @wingpig, HWH do seem to have more than their share of crap drivers. (or it may just be confirmation bias on my part)

    Posted 5 years ago #
  25. Stickman
    Member

    Driver of black Porsche 4x4 registration "1976 M" was so engrossed in her phone that she missed two sets of lights changing on Fountainbridge. It must have been important as it couldn't wait for her to turn into the car park of her work on Semple St seconds later.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  26. dougal
    Member

    Last night's ride home from Tollcross to Leith full of total Wayne Kerrs. Passes close enough that I could shave my arm hair on their wing mirror, car horns blaring behind me, drivers creeping forward into the ASZ that I'm occupying while the light is still red. Exactly 100% of the stuff that makes people never want to cycle.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  27. neddie
    Member

    Toads of Barony Castle

    Look at how light those cars look, compared to today's monstrosities. More akin to 4-wheeled motorbikes.

    Posted 5 years ago #
  28. Ed1
    Member

  29. morepathsplease
    Member

    @wingpig, HWH do seem to have more than their share of crap drivers. (or it may just be confirmation bias on my part)

    They were a standout when I used to cycle Prestonpans to Cramond - hard not to notice the danger the way they drive, often at high speed in built-up areas. They somehow reek of strong "get off the road!".

    Posted 5 years ago #
  30. glasgow megasnake
    Member

    Not so sure about the MGs but I could happily be close passed by Bugatti type 35s all day long.

    Posted 5 years ago #

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