Sure this has come up on here before - can't find in Search.
Mentioned by various people on CallKaye as 'a good idea'.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Debate!
Cycle mirrors
(23 posts)-
Posted 12 years ago #
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The Pino came with one, as did the Helios hired from LaidBack.
They may have made me a bit lazier with the shoulder checks, as they were so handy. I can definitely see their benefit for recumbents or for folk who have difficulty looking over their shoulder.
Given that the correct shoulder check should be much longer than most folk perform, mirrors might be an improvement.
Of course, the usual arguments apply - putting the onus on personal protective equipment rather than engineered safety.
Robert
Posted 12 years ago # -
Whilst I do try to look behind when passing parked cars, I would expect (in a sane world) cars who want to pass me to anticipate that I would want to come out into the road to pass the parked car rather than crash into it.
These level of anticipatory driving is taught by the Institute of Advanced Motorists. It really should become standard.
Posted 12 years ago # -
"I would expect (in a sane world) cars who want to pass me to anticipate that I would want to come out into the road to pass the parked car rather than crash into it."
Yep, I've been beeped a few times for having the temerity not to ride straight into the back of a parked car, or stop behind it waiting for the real traffic to pass before I'm allowed to.
We don't, after all, see cars weaving back and forth from left to centre-lane avoiding parked cars - they simply take a straight line approach.
Posted 12 years ago # -
I amuse myself when riding a short way behind someone to pull out early, and see whether they will check before moving out themselves.
I suppose it could turn into active education if I had a speaker and a recording of a skidding car to blare at them when they fail ;-)
Posted 12 years ago # -
I know that J*hn Fr*nkl*n doesn't like them, if I remember correctly because they discourage shoulder checks but also because road vibration might make them unusable anyway. Any users have any comments on the vibration thing?
Posted 12 years ago # -
I used to have a mirror on the handlebar (straight ones). It did vibrate but was usable. However for some reason I never liked it and it does encourage to spend to much time looking backwards.
Posted 12 years ago # -
These are handy for straight/riser bars eg. MTB, hybrid, city bike: Topeak Bar'n'Mirror, essentially alloy bar ends with flip-out mirrors built in, can be adjusted to give a clear view on either side.
They're great, I've had them on the hybrid for 2 1/2 years and use them when in really heavy traffic, and whenever I tow the tagalong or carry a kid in the child seat. Handy for spotting vehicles approaching/about to overtake. Also can keep an eye on kids to make sure they're okay without having to take my eyes off the road. No problems with vibration except in extreme conditions.
Posted 12 years ago # -
The Pino has a Mirracycle on the bar end and the image is stable - I don't recall what the Helios had, but it was also stable. Possibly the mounts have come on a bit?
I think they probably compliment a shoulder check. They provide continuous information on a small volume of the road behind, whereas a shoulder check gives an instantaneous (or ideally longer!) snapshot of the whole street.
Odd that a vehicular cycling advocate thinks a vehicle shouldn't have mirrors!
Robert
Posted 12 years ago # -
"Odd that a vehicular cycling advocate thinks a vehicle shouldn't have mirrors!"
Well to be fair, pilots of vehicles of the four wheeled variety can't see behind themselves without them. It would be much much better if they could! And motorcyclists can travel a lot faster than push bikes, making taking your eye off the road in front potentially dangerous.
Cyclecraft was written some time ago so I suspect mirror mount technology has improved greatly since then.
Posted 12 years ago # -
On a low (ok, low-ish) recumbent they work really well, as they sit just out of my normal eyeline, rather than requiring a definite head movement to look at. Certainly in urban areas I'll be glancing at it every few seconds, meaning if I have to swerve for any reason (child, car pulling out, giant pothole) I've got a reasonable idea what's behind me.
I now tend to only shoulder check when pulling out into traffic from a standstill, or when turning left in slower traffic for anyone undertaking.
Posted 12 years ago # -
Mirrors on motorcycles are in addition to shoulder checks and rear observations not an alternative.
A shoulder check should be made before any significant change of direction/position, a full rear observation during the planning phase before any full manouvre. Lifesaver checks of course in the last seconds before committing yourself.90% of drivers fail to make the minumum number of rear/side observations, some make none(!) and many cyclists/motorcyclists are not much better :-(
Even if you don't make the full number of recommended observations (which imho are a *little* excessive on quiet roads in good conditions) the shoulder chacks and lifesavers are an absolute minimum which should be second nature to any town rider (who doesn't want scared witless several times a day!)
Edited to add: Sorry for the ramble,
Short version: You can do without mirrors but you can't do without shoulder checks and lifesavers! ;-)Posted 12 years ago # -
I wear glasses, and am short sighted enough that I need them to see what's happening. I can't shoulder check effectively because I can't turn my head round far enough backwards to see through my glasses (rather than round the side of them) and get an unfuzzy view of the world.
For this reason, I have a bar-end mirror. It doesn't wobble or vibrate. I use it continuously to get a picture of what's happening behind before I do any manoeuvre. I reckon it gives a good view of the whole situation. Clearly there's a blind spot, but I can see what's in this if I turn my head.
Posted 12 years ago # -
I really like having a mirror on the Helios, both for children-watching and traffic. I still shoulder check, esp on busy roads.
Hadn't thought about glasses/head-turning problems -suspect Greenroofer is right and this may contribute to why I like the mirror so much.
Posted 12 years ago # -
Over shoulder check is indicative to person behind that you are awake and about to make a move. Problem with mirrors is they cut down on 'body language'. Recumbents obscure body language anyway so I do look round too when I know that cars may 'pretend' not to see me.
Posted 12 years ago # -
I ALWAYS look back before moving right, or left. Heck I even do it as a pedestrian. I see other peds just stepping left or right with no check or look even on the dedicated cyclepaths.
If bike mirrors were to become a legal requirement I think I should get a set of HGV mirrors, 2ft high! Should make more likely I'll be given a wide berth.
Posted 12 years ago # -
"I think I should get a set of HGV mirrors, 2ft high!"
That would slow you down!
Posted 12 years ago # -
"I wear glasses, and am short sighted enough that I need them to see what's happening. I can't shoulder check effectively because I can't turn my head round far enough backwards to see through my glasses (rather than round the side of them) and get an unfuzzy view of the world"
That's pretty much why I don't like riding in my glasses and use contacts most of the time.
Posted 12 years ago # -
I am an avid supporter of shoulder checks. I like to know whats going on at all times and regular checks don't just show you what people are doing directly behind you but also allow you to see whats going to happen in 10 cars time etc.
Never used mirrors but if I go touring again I'm tempted as it's easier on a long straight road to be surprised when the "car" coming up behind you turns out to be a lorry. Also good for keeping an eye on your panniers!
Posted 12 years ago # -
Yes, of course we should look over our shoulders, but there are times when braking or attempting certain manoeuvres when that is not easy. Mirrors help, though I tend to mostly use them when transporting kids.
Posted 12 years ago # -
"I am an avid supporter of shoulder checks."
I did this the other day and had to stop and appologise to the old dear..... :D
Posted 12 years ago # -
Got a mirracycle and cant believe I went so long without one, it feels weird only knowing whats going on behind me some of the time now, on the bent you just have to flick your eyes, not turn your whole head. I turn my head to check my blind spot (mostly for cyclists, I am a long vehicle) before I change lanes but find I don't need to look all the way back anymore (tho I can).
Posted 12 years ago # -
DaveC - don't joke I managed to shoulder check an oldie who stepped backwards off a kerb on prices street as I was checking over my (opposite) shoulder for what the bus was doing. I felt a bump on my shoulder and wobbled to a stop and looked back. Old dear sprawled over the road - obviously ran back and checked her over. People stood around were confused as to how she got there and lady didnt really know how she'd got into the road. Really shook me up.
Posted 12 years ago #
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