From reading EEN comments, most people who are against this scheme are against it because they think it'll be ignored. Very few are actually against the concept of everyone driving at 20mph.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Infrastructure
20 mph - consultation coming soon
(256 posts)-
Posted 8 years ago #
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"most people who are against this scheme are against it because they think it'll be ignored."
Aye right! What they mean is THEY intend to ignore it, because, well if they don't everyone else will, and that wouldn't be fair because there's no enforcement. They don't see why they should have to be the only ones obeying the law when everyone else and their dog is flouting it... etc. other self-justifications ad nauseam.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"When a man is tired of the idiocy of the EEN comments he is tired of life"
Posted 8 years ago # -
wrong thread
Posted 8 years ago # -
From the consultation PDF linked to in another thread:
"20mph Speed Limit
Councillors approved a new speed limit network for Edinburgh at the Transport and Environment Committee on 13 January 2015, after three years of research and public consultation. Residential roads, shopping streets as well as the city centre are now included as 20mph roads. Leith town centre is in phase 2, commencing June 2016."That's quite soon!
:-)
P.S.:- Leith town centre is defined as the whole of Leith Walk including Elm Row, plus Great Junction Street, Kirkgate centre, etc.
Posted 8 years ago # -
What will the suggested speed limit be along queen street?
Posted 8 years ago # -
@gembo
The only speed limit on Queen Street has always been 186,282 miles per second.
Posted 8 years ago # -
@iwrats, yes I normally cut down to the quieter cobble streets, heriot tow, Abercrombie place etc as light speed of vehicles with combustion engines combined with potholes is not a pleasant cocktail
Posted 8 years ago # -
!!!!!!
I think there's a whole thread on here from years ago 'proving' that.
"
In response to an early council consultation in 2013, it said: “We are particularly concerned to emphasise that 20mph limits should not be introduced on bus routes, except in very localised applications (such as Moredun). This is because measures which tend to increase overall bus journey times tend also to undermine the economics of the provision of the affected bus services.
"
Posted 8 years ago # -
no data, just recycled opinions, and no contrasting opinions until the very end. what total rubbish. i've tried calling them on it and they just insist they're being balanced.
Posted 8 years ago # -
From Radio Forth's Twitter feed this morning:
Is anyone in favour of the 20mph speed limit in #Edinburgh? Not one caller supporting it on #ScotlandsTalkIn so far. Call 0333 2020 401
Didn't notice this until the phone in was over, but made the following reply:
.@RadioForthNews Hopefully you fully explained all the facts and justifications for the scheme before the call-in? Context is everything.
Posted 8 years ago # -
Another high class EN comment -
"
The only people who complain about too many cars on the road seems to be the anti-car brigade, the very same people who use this as justification for their anti-car measures. What drivers are generally unhappy about are the unnecessary measures which slow and stop the traffic flow for no reason whatsoever, the state of the pothole ridden roads, road closures, etc... which all increase congestion, pollution and travel time, all of which are as a result of council meddling. There is no need for it.
"
Posted 8 years ago # -
I still think that instead of a having a car free day, we should have a free for all day just to show how bad it would be if everyone tried to get around by cars without any parking restrictions traffic lights etc.
Cars have wonderful benefits - they get you from A to B relatively cheaply (at point of use) and comfortably. The downside is that they pollute and you have to slowdown/stop if another road user is using the piece of road you want to use.
Given there is c.250,000 miles of UK roads, we each have 7metres of road to use. So the system only works if we don't all try to use the roads at the same time or we are efficient in how we use it.
Single occupancy vehicles at rush hour cannot be the answer.
Everyone using the bus, train, bike path or pavement is allowing someone else to use 'their' 7metres of road for the greater good and should be commended for it.
Posted 8 years ago # -
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@BCCletts: @walkcyclevote @CyclingEdin Will be nice to re-introduce the 20mph limit & ironically fitting it this took 100 years from date it was dumped
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Posted 8 years ago # -
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@BCCletts: @walkcyclevote @CyclingEdin Key way to enforce 20mph in towns is to fit all Euro engine HGV & PSV with GPS speed control & set up cordons
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Posted 8 years ago # -
"
Ian Maxwell, of Lothian cycle campaigners Spokes, said the move would “accelerate the growth” of cycling across the city.
He said: “We are very positive about the idea and we have seen how well 20mph had worked in other areas.
“Any speed reduction is going to be useful and it will also mean that the roads are less intimidating to people who are thinking of cycling. If the road looks safer, then more people will ride bikes.
"
Posted 8 years ago # -
<mischief>
Ian Maxwell says "it’s slower than we would like, but it’s happening."
Neig Greig says "If you really want to make people feel safe, you should be looking to change the nature of the roads... It’s about actually spending more money on infrastructure."
I'm confused as to who we usually cheer?
</mischievous selective quoting>
Robert
Posted 8 years ago # -
“Lower speed limits will soon be the new norm for all residential and shopping streets"
Ever since I moved here I've wondered why Edinburgh shopping streets aren't pedestrianized. Not as a "car hating cyclist" (I didn't cycle back then) but as a person who had just been driven into town and parked right outside the shops (after a few laps, I suspect).
The town I grew up in and every UK city I've lived in or visited since (admittedly not a huge list, mostly northern England) has followed a similar pattern:
* Pedestrianized shopping streets
* Car parks around the outside
* Bus routes along adjacent streetsNone of these places has struggled to get people to visit the shops. Why is Edinburgh so different? Why is it so "controversial" to lower the speed limit in a place where most (again, based on my very limited experience) UK cities don't allow cars at all?
Posted 8 years ago # -
The "shopping streets" here are ones like Leith Walk, Bridges - Newington, Morningside Road.
Not so many opportunities for being car free (perhaps George Street?), but certainly opportunities for making things better for pedestrians (and cyclists).
Posted 8 years ago # -
@chdot good point. I was thinking of everything between Princes Street and Queen Street.
I'm not saying that the 20mph limit won't help in this area, I'm just pondering on why it seems to be such a battle when other cities banned cars from the centre decades ago. Maybe it only seems like a battle because I'm looking at EEN articles.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"Maybe it only seems like a battle because I'm looking at EEN articles."
Not entirety, there is opposition.
BUT if EN was more 'progressive'/'in favour of' Edinburgh it might make a difference.
Might even find that more people were actually willing to post 'in favour' comments.
Posted 8 years ago # -
"
@SpokesLothian: .@Edinburgh_CC Transport Committee #edinbwebcast NOW. Conservatives to oppose #20mph. https://t.co/roxv5X3S3k @CyclingEdin @edfoc @SRDorman
"
Posted 8 years ago # -
"Conservatives to oppose 20mph"
Just as well I kept the email from Jeremy Balfour where he agreed with my suggestion on extending the roads included in the plan, and said he'd pass it on to his colleague on the Transport Committee.
He won't just be spinning in the wind because the EEN commenters are frothing would he? Surely he has more principles than that?
Posted 8 years ago # -
@SpokesLothian
Edin Transport Cttee votes 10-3 for citywide #20mph planPosted 8 years ago # -
Hurrah!
Posted 8 years ago # -
'critics insist the proposals will see the city “grind to a halt”'
Since when is 20mph "grinding to a halt"?
Posted 8 years ago # -
"Since when is 20mph "grinding to a halt"?"
It's about a complete lack of knowledge of fluid dynamics (and of course 'I want to go where I want as fast as I like').
Rollout stages
Posted 8 years ago # -
As regular readers will be aware, I've admitted to voting in ways I regret on occasions.
Watching the Committee just now is making me question my Council voting record.
<sigh>
Robert
Posted 8 years ago # -
Was it just the Conservatives who voted against?
Posted 8 years ago # -
I didn't see the vote, but I do know the Conservatives happen to have three members on the Transport and Environment Committee. Coincidence?
Posted 8 years ago #
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