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UKIP => yes to independence?

(189 posts)
  • Started 11 years ago by Darkerside
  • Latest reply from kaputnik

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  1. calmac
    Member

    I used to think there would be more powers after independence, but now I don't. No-one has said anything about what kind of powers they'd transfer. If they're not talking serious taxation (basically all of it but we pay a certain amount back for armed forces etc), welfare, energy, industry, competition and employment, then they're obviously not remotely serious.

    And if they'd really wanted a third option, they'd have put it on the ballot paper.

    Vote No Borders had adverts in the papers this week "guaranteeing" us more powers over schools and the NHS. Yeah. Make of that what you will.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  2. wee folding bike
    Member

    We already control the schools and NHS, always have.

    Nob Orders can promise more powers because of the Scotland act 2012 but it's not really more powers, it's more responsibilities.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  3. crowriver
    Member

    Well, UKIP seem to have successfully set the agenda for this bunch of Westminster politicians: "Labour MPs urge leadership to curb free movement within EU"

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jun/01/labour-mps-urge-curb-eu-free-movement-open-letter-ed-miliband

    Posted 11 years ago #

  4. Instography
    Member

    "I used to think there would be more powers after independence, but now I don't."

    (Shome mishtake, shurely? Ed)

    Posted 11 years ago #

  5. calmac
    Member

    Hmm. Yes, bit of a train wreck there. I meant "after a No vote". Can't explain how I bottommed that one so badly.

    Anyway, while I'm here, something of use - YouGov asked questions about racism in their poll for the Sunday Times last week.

    27% of people described themselves as a little or very prejudiced against people of other races, and 17% said they had some views that are racist. This was self-declared!

    37% said they would be uncomfortable if a family of Romanians moved in next door. 8% said the same about a family of Germans, 33% for Pakistanis, 36% for Nigerians.

    34% think the Uk is more racist than 10 years ago, 30% think it's the same, and 28% say less racist.

    People in Scotland had pretty much the same views as the rest of the UK - only London was notably better than the average.

    And unsurprisingly Ukippers were much more likley to describe themselves as prejudiced or holding racist views. They were twice as likely to be uncomfortable with a foreign family living next door.

    Depressing stuff, really.

    http://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/8fglspvdzl/YG-Archive-Pol-Sunday-Times-results-140530.pdf

    Posted 11 years ago #

  6. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    @calmac

    Don't be too down. British (sic) culture is incredibly tolerant compared to the way it was even in my youth and compared to many other places.

    I had a friend translate abuse being directed at the Moroccan football team by another Moroccan. The language would have made the National Front blush, even though abuser and abused both looked 'black' to me. I've had a professor from a reputable East European university politley but firmly insist in a social setting that Gypsies are genetically pre-disposed to crime and require special control measures. I have worked with Chinese people who think of black people as not fully human. One of my own grandmothers was horrified by the appearance of African students on the Aberdeen buses in the early seventies.

    I think it is to our great credit that we've started talking about these things, and also that the referendum debate has so far avoided developing any ethnic strand.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  7. chdot
    Admin

    "

    Labour and Lib Dem sources said that some of their natural supporters voted tactically for the Tories to keep out Ukip.

    "

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jun/06/newark-byelection-result-conservatives-win-comfortably-with-ukip-second-and-labour-third

    Posted 11 years ago #

  8. calmac
    Member

    In a constituency in which Labour ought to have been a realistic contender, and that they held 1997-2001, I'm not sure I buy that argument from Labour.

    The loss of votes from the Lib Dems is pretty shocking.

    I think about 27,000 voted Tory or UKIP. Fewer than 7,000 voted Labour. Hmm.

    Posted 11 years ago #

  9. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Lib Dem sources said that some all of their natural supporters voted tactically for the Tories to keep out Ukip

    FTFY.

    Posted 11 years ago #

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