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And now? (Not the White Paper thread)

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  1. crowriver
    Member

    Great quote for the (sucker) punch line:

    'Brown’s former adviser Damian McBride said Labour was whistling in the wind if it thought it could make Miliband more popular by putting him out on the doorstep.

    Asked if he gave credence to claims about a letter being circulated among backbenchers, he replied: “I don’t know, and it’s difficult to know because the paranoia that comes out of the Miliband camp is so rank that they will invent plots even when there are none.

    “But I think the mood is pretty black in Labour, and certainly since the conference. Since party conference the mood has got blacker and these are wild times.” '

    Ouch!

    Posted 9 years ago #
  2. Instography
    Member

    Damien McBride's blog is an excellent read. I've read this one a few times - when it was published, at times during the referendum and just now. It gives a great insight into how politics works and who's winning.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  3. kaputnik
    Moderator

    That would be Damien "I had to resign over a plan to fabricate rumours about the sexuality and/or sex-lives of Conservative MPs and disseminate them as fact on a quasi-genuine political blog" McBride?

    Or a different one?

    Posted 9 years ago #
  4. chdot
    Admin

    "

    LOTHIAN MSP Sarah Boyack today launched her campaign to become the new leader of Scottish Labour, calling on the party to be “bold and radical” and promising to work with the SNP.

    "

    http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/scottish-labour-sarah-boyack-vows-to-unite-party-1-3597488

    Posted 9 years ago #
  5. Stickman
    Member

    "That would be Damien "I had to resign over a plan to fabricate rumours about the sexuality and/or sex-lives of Conservative MPs and disseminate them as fact on a quasi-genuine political blog" McBride?

    Or a different one?"

    And don't forget spreading rumours about the medical conditions of Conservative MP's wives.

    An absolutely charming character. Of course Gordob Brown knew nothing about it, not a thing, zilch, zip, nada.......

    Posted 9 years ago #
  6. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    Mr McBride may well have done some shameful things, but it is a fundamental principle of the Enlightenment that the value of a proposition is independent of the standing of the person proposing it. Unless the proposition depends in some way on the proposer's good character.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  7. chdot
    Admin

    "Unless the proposition depends in some way on the proposer's good character"

    There's always a catch...

    Posted 9 years ago #
  8. Instography
    Member

    Indeed, the very same one. I didn't say I liked the guy but his blog is a pretty no holds barred view how politics is played.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  9. chdot
    Admin

    A little understanding is a dangerous thing!

    "

    The headline figures show little UK-wide support for regional party the Scottish Nationalist Party (SNP), but the regional figures show a different story – the SNP scooped up 58.8 percent in Scotland

    "

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/07/Ukip-on-Up-And-Up-as-Latest-Poll-Puts-Them-on-24-Percent

    Posted 9 years ago #
  10. kaputnik
    Moderator

    Of course, the UK's FPTP electoral system means that 24% of the popular vote doesn't mean 24% of the seats. In the 1974 General Election, the Liberal Party (as it then was) took 20% of the popular vote and got 2% of the seats.

    In Scotland, parties other than Labour / Tories (i.e. the SNP, mainly) have consistently returned far less seats than their share of the popular vote might otherwise suggest.

    To do well in FPTP, strong support in a small number of areas (as UKIP may well get in the SE of England, and other corners of immigrant and EU paranioa) far outweighs moderate support across all areas (as the Lib Dems have been finding out).

    Posted 9 years ago #
  11. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    I suspect that the SNP would do quite well if it fielded candidates in the North of England. My brother lives there and despairs of having to chose twice a decade between a range of buckets of sick at various temperatures.

    A populist social democratic party with no aims on the south-east that credibly claimed it wouldn't collaborate with the Tories would maybe get a decent hearing.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  12. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    You can tell from the pictures they use that the BBC is utterly impartial in the selection of the new branch manager of the Labour party in Scotland.

    Jim Murphy: low viewpoint, imperial purple background and heroic pose;

    http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/78641000/jpg/_78641853_murphy_conference_getty.jpg

    Neil Findlay: high viewpoint, man picking his nose and bored lady in background, apologetic pose;

    http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/78846000/jpg/_78846988_49c42de9-dccd-4316-ab47-3ded257640f4.jpg

    Posted 9 years ago #
  13. crowriver
    Member

    Where's the picture of Ms Boyack then?

    Posted 9 years ago #
  14. chdot
    Admin

  15. crowriver
    Member

    Yay! Boyack for Prez of Lab (Scotland branch office).

    Posted 9 years ago #
  16. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    That's Keiza Dugdale next to her?

    Posted 9 years ago #
  17. crowriver
    Member

    Aye. The cycling dream team for Lab (SBO).

    Probably never happen.

    Instead we'll get a nuke enthusiast soft beverage crate hopper with a fondness for megaphone shoutiness, an aversion to eggs and a dodgy expenses record. Kezia as deputy if you're lucky.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  18. crowriver
    Member

    From Scottish CND:

    Scottish Labour leadership candidates split over Trident

    Published on Friday, 07 November 2014 11:33

    The candidates for leadership of the Scottish Labour party have clearly different views on Trident. Jim Murphy is an active supporter of the British nuclear weapons' programme. Neil Findlay and Katy Clark are both campaigners for nuclear disarmament.

    Sarah Boyack has spoken against, but not voted against Trident replacement. Kezia Dugdale's statement appears to endorse the official UK Labour party line.

    Continues in more detail here:

    http://www.banthebomb.org/index.php/news/trident/1624-scottish-labour-leadership-candidates

    It's worth reading the CND article just to see how rabidly pro-WMD Murphy really is. He's like a Scottish Donald Rumsfeld.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  19. chdot
    Admin

  20. chdot
    Admin

  21. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    We just keep hitting the mother lode of irony ore.

    http://www.scotsman.com/news/uk/jim-murphy-promises-to-stop-cash-flowing-south-1-3600661

    Labour's cash stays in Scotland, whilst Scotland's cash heads to London.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  22. crowriver
    Member

    Apparently Scotland could let the Labour party down at the general election.

    [+] Embed the video | Video DownloadGet the Flash Video

    What do you say, Scots? Shall we let the Labour party down? With a crash or a whimper? Your choice.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  23. kaputnik
    Moderator

    http://www.heraldscotland.com/mobile/politics/scottish-politics/revealed-just-how-many-members-does-labour-really-have-in-scotland.25814760

    Read this article and it doesn't really begin to scratch the surface of their complicated and inflationary ways of "counting" their membership. The figure they gave is quite probably a gross over-estimate of actual branch membership.

    It did make the good point that it takes 168 party member votes to equal one elected member's vote.

    There was also a piece on Jim Murphy accepting a £10,000 donation from a Tory donor ("London businessman" Alan Sharr) towards the expenses of running his office. Alan Sharr is Principal of Marriott's Chartered Accountants, who specialize - to quote their own web page - in "Advising on tax minimisation" (i.e. in helping the wealthy avoid enough tax to be able to make free with 5-figure donations to the receptive political parties of their choosing.)

    Posted 9 years ago #
  24. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    The FM to be making mischief as ever;

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-30023639

    "it is expected that supporters of the Union would resist Ms Sturgeon's call" Mmmmm-hmmm.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  25. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    So we all remember how only the Union could save shipbuilding on the Clyde.That proposition was a central plank of the Better Together campaign on the west coast;

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-27979281

    http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/independence-bae-hint-at-clyde-shipyard-closures-1-3304301

    and now?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-30032217

    Admiral Zambellas appears to be making political decisions on our behalf. Thank the Lord we don't have a written constitution to fetter his free-market glee.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  26. kaputnik
    Moderator

    There were any number of political / trade union / military types queuing up before the Referendum to remind everyone, categorically, that the Royal Navy does not buy warships made outside the UK, and that it would not do so in the future. We only buy British.

    This conveniently overlooked the fact that there's no military-industrial base in the UK that's actually capable of building an entirely home grown warship. Let's have a look at the the current pride of "British shipbuilding", the Type 45 Destroyer. This was built with steel from an Indian-owned steel company, has a Franco-Italian missile system, a Dutch search radar, Finnish diesel engines, Franco-American electric propulsion motors, Anglo-Franco-American main gas-turbines, Anglo-American sonar, American navigation radars and systems, an American ship operating system, American anti-ship missiles, American and Swiss light weapons and an Anglo-Italian helicopter. But we only buy British.

    This is not at all surprising actually, the Americans are probably the only nation who have the military-industrial base to do most everything home grown. The big defence companies are all multinationals (BAE systems has more operations outside the UK than in it). The UK and most other European nations have been collaborating with each other and the US, and buying each others bits and pieces of kit to stick on their ships for years. But we only buy British.

    The Royal Fleet Auxiliary (the MoD-owned, merchant-manned naval support service) is full of ships that were foreign built, including their latest and flashiest fleet replenishers which are coming from Korea. But these aren't strictly speaking warships, they are just military owned ships without with the Royal Navy's Warships can't go to war so we still only buy British.

    There were lots of proud pro-UK pictures of the ceremony naming the new aircraft carrier at Rosyth, with the big blue gantry crane required to assemble the thing in the background. The press and No-sayers were all very quiet on the fact it had to be bought in from China... But of course an rUK would never have bought a Scottish crane to build warships, after all, they only buy British when it comes to Warships.

    So really what the categorical assertion came down to is we only assemble multinational components into warships in the UK. Up until now. With some exceptions..

    This all may come across as a bit of schadenfreude, but I assure you it's schadenschaden.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  27. gibbo
    Member

    @crowriver

    Apparently Scotland could let the Labour party down at the general election.

    They're so myopic. It's all about them and their party.

    But it seems like the people of Scotland - or a large chunk of them, at least - understand that an SNP seat is a non-tory seat.

    We don't need Labour.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  28. chdot
    Admin

    "

    TALKS to reach a deal on new powers for Holyrood are making “good progress”, the man charged with leading the group has declared.

    The Smith Commission was set up shortly after the the independence referendum and was tasked with considering what additional responsibilities should be transferred north from Westminster.

    Chairman Lord Smith said the discussions so far had been “intensive” but added there was a “real determination to reach agreement”.

    "

    http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/smith-commission-making-good-progress-1-3604197

    Posted 9 years ago #
  29. LaidBack
    Member

    Kaputnik - the intertwining of defence systems was possibly a factor when a French and British sub collided with each other (slightly) in the Atlantic a few years back. Only an estimated £50 million of damage and no radioactive leaks we know of!

    Thales Optronics (of France) supplies quite a few parts for both navies and owns Barr and Stroud in Glasgow - suppliers to RN and other navies.

    Posted 9 years ago #
  30. chdot
    Admin

    "

    Kerevan: SNP should revisit pound stance
    Saturday 15 November 2014
    The SNP needs to look again at its position on sharing the pound with the rest of the UK after independence as it failed to win the economic debate in the run-up to the referendum, an activist has said.

    George Kerevan said that, while nationalists had had the better economic case, they failed to convince many middle-class professionals.

    "

    http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/scottish-politics/kerevan-snp-should-revist-pound-stance.1416056843

    Posted 9 years ago #

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