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Do we need an EU referendum thread? (Brexit thread)

(3978 posts)
  • Started 8 years ago by I were right about that saddle
  • Latest reply from chdot

  1. chdot
    Admin

    In truth, the merits or mistakes of this decision will take years to show. The economy is expected to grow more slowly, but a country's value is not just measured in pounds and pence.

    Brexit in a complete sense has always been hard to define. Today we will start to find out what it will really mean.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51336075

    Posted 4 years ago #
  2. chdot
    Admin

  3. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    Duly stripped of my citizenship in the company of madame IWRATS and our own @kaputnik and @unhurt. Couldn't track @algo down in the crowd.

    The Orange Order turned up with a frilly Union flag mounted on a spear but the police surrounded them and a guy mocked them through the medium of tuba music.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  4. LaidBack
    Member

    Saw @Kaputnik with Tilley light at the 10-11 shift.

    We did both the 5.30 to 7.30 and the later one. Lots of people didn't want to turn up as they have had enough of being on losing side. Lesley Riddoch was a good compere.

    I was pleased to see people from EU community there as they try to work out what will happen next.
    We had a visit between shifts to Sofi's Southside - only appropriate to go to a Swedish run business!

    Flag now in window at bike emporium. Not controversial in a country where 53 out of 59 MPs are pro EU. Suppose we are conformists on this.

    ps - I see Gibralter is back - will not be included in any UK deal.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  5. chdot
    Admin

  6. LaidBack
    Member

    Delusional?  "I think the market’s too big not to come to an agreement over tourist visas and mutual deals.”

    Then again Scotland is about to have its resources in a negotiation which our government has no say in.
    Madrid and London probably happy to divi up the fishing grounds in return for millionaires not being inconvenienced. Last thing Spanish Gov may want will be any dealing with Edinburgh as our courts have kept Clara Ponsatti safe from extradition and a huge jail sentence.
    I note Guardian article mentions Catalunya 'separatists' are right wingers. If that is the case then rest of Spain must be ultra right.

    Meanwhile our Dutch friends tell me that a Scottish flag is now up on street in Leeuwarden in place of union flag.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  7. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    I just remembered that I had to use violence for the first time in ages on Brexmas night. Guy in the pub (who had been all friendly at the parliament) getting all frisky in the pub afterwards and I had to grab him by the nuts and tell him to calm down in order to reach the toilets. Most peculiar, mama.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  8. chdot
    Admin

  9. LaidBack
    Member

    Robert Peston and other journalists in mass walk out yesterday in response to Dominic C's attempt to restrict press access.
    He should expect more of these - just one poll of course.

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1224451089124089860?s=19

    Major £5 million ad pitch coming to promote Scotland's relationship to UK.
    Should go to a Scottish ad agency of course ;-)

    Posted 4 years ago #
  10. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    I guess both we and our politicians have all grown up expecting votes to change post-holders but not society. Nice game of snakes and ladders.

    I think the sweaty panic evident in London is those same people realising that they have now made irreversible changes to our society and being very frightened about the whole thing running out of their control.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  11. chdot
    Admin

    Putting the lead back in paint, the sewage back on beaches and enhancing the lethality of children’s toys. These are just some of the “opportunities” for deregulation offered in Sajid Javid’s call for the public to propose ways to diverge from the EU rulebook.

    Slashing European regulation has long been an article of faith for the Tory party, fulfilling both its Thatcherite and Europhobic instincts. No matter that recent history – from the global financial crisis to the tragedy at Grenfell Tower – has taught us that regulation is a public good to be protected, not an evil to be eradicated.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/07/brexit-regulation-britain-eu-agencies-sajid-javid

    Posted 4 years ago #
  12. LaidBack
    Member

    Scotland can't / won't go there.

    Only 6 MPs would publically support this.

    SNP/Lab//LibDem/ScotGreen need to stay together.
    ScotGoesPop/YouGov poll finds 56% of people polled in Scotland believe UK is no longer a totally democratic state.
    English voters less so on this but still not happy.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  13. LaidBack
    Member

    Dear Scotland...

    https://bellacaledonia.org.uk/2020/02/07/dear-scotland-2/

    Posted 4 years ago #
  14. LaidBack
    Member

    European politics affect us more than ever?
    Election day in Ireland.

    https://twitter.com/IrishTimes/status/1226264516482289664?s=19

    Irish Border poll closer?

    Posted 4 years ago #
  15. chdot
    Admin

  16. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    Interesting point on the Border Poll. The UK of GB&NI is obliged by international treaty to offer one if the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland believes that a majority will vote in favour of unification.

    The UK of GB&NI is - it seems - seriously proposing to apply tariffs on goods passing between Great Britain and Northern Ireland from December this year. They also plan to leave large parts of EU law in force in the province.

    It looks to me like a clear message to loyalists and unionists that they are of no consequence to London. I've no idea how they'll react, but looking over the border into an EU state with a per capita GDP nearly twice theirs.....there will surely be temptations.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  17. gembo
    Member

    Dust down the rum, time to get smugglin’

    Posted 4 years ago #
  18. LaidBack
    Member

    From Irish Times...

    Paul Donnelly tops the poll ahead of Leo Varadkar in Dublin West, Donnelly’s 3,300 surplus is expected to go 50% to Ruth Coppinger and 13% to the Green Party candidate O’Gorman who is 584 ahead of Coppinger. Other transfers are too difficult to call at the moment. #GE2020 https://t.co/qWSDTW7Pii

    Currently 3 Green TDs in Dáil.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  19. unhurt
    Member

    A lot of British / English twitter commentary seems quite convinced that Ireland is somehow voting about Brexit. It's very weird. It's almost like they don't think Ireland is a proper country (the UK apparently being some sort of Platonic ideal of nationhood).

    Posted 4 years ago #
  20. crowriver
    Member

    Sinn Fein surge obviously the big story. Greens also enjoying a mini surge...

    Posted 4 years ago #
  21. LaidBack
    Member

    12 Green TDs in Dublin now.

    Process of forming a government underway.

    https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1227225286787391488?s=09

    Posted 4 years ago #
  22. chdot
    Admin

  23. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    It's good of the EU to persist with publishing documents in English.

    Here's there plan for solidarity in the face of the rogue pirate state just offshore.

    Main aim is to "ensure a balance of rights and obligations, and a level playing field that will stand the test of time. This balance must ensure the autonomy of the Union’s decision-making and legal order, ensure the protection of the Union’s financial interests and be consistent with the other Union principles set out in the relevant European Council guidelines, in particular with respect to the integrity of the Single Market and the Customs Union and the indivisibility of the four freedoms"

    I think that means the Conservative and Unionist party will be installing a full customs border between Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Also they'll be facing huge regulatory and tariff barriers if they don't follow instructions.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  24. chdot
    Admin

  25. Baldcyclist
    Member

    Why wait till June, they know what they want now?

    Posted 4 years ago #
  26. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    They may know what they want but somebody has to be to blame for it. The six months allow a tendering exercise for a whole scapegoat slaughterhouse.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  27. chdot
    Admin

    “Why wait”

    “scapegoat”

    All likely true.

    There’s a small chance that they are just so inept that they really believe that the EU will cave when faced with the ’tough UK’.

    Of course Boris is completely capable of u-turning on any promises to anyone (inc UK voters) so the only certainty is more months of uncertainty (followed by years of uncertainties).

    Posted 4 years ago #
  28. LaidBack
    Member

    ... everything going to plan then?!

    Anyone with family and business contacts in EU will know that the cost to this inflexible position is much more than financial.

    UKGov very predictable in so many ways.

      - inability to compromise on any issue
      - hatred of courts (Heathrow 3rd Runway decision went against them - hurrah)
      - a commitment to punish anyone that doesn't mirror their every changing hokey cokey politics.
      - a solemn promise to not honour any commitments given previously (Northern Ireland EUUK status)
      - a cast iron pledge to Scotland that its population will have the thinnest of a Brexit Bonuses* as long as they stay 'off message' and fail to come to terms with their utter irrelevance in everything.

      * Clear UKGov policy is to reward the parts of 'the north' which decided to switch to Tory. The Scots need to watch what happens when they repeatedly make the wrong choices. State media have all the levers to tell people here that they are misguided in their viewpoint yet it seems the population is not listening. Their blond leader woos us by attacking our (untrue) high taxes, poor education system and numerous drug death rate. ScotGov should get on with its day job - says a man still to pass a UK budget.

    Posted 4 years ago #
  29. chdot
    Admin

    “Anyone with family and business contacts in EU will know that the cost to this inflexible position is much more than financial.”

    Yes, and if anyone wants to believe that the EU needs the UK so much that it will do some sort of ‘UK deal’, they will have to consider how much the EU will be unwilling to do any sort of deal as the UK (or at least its current Gov) is so unfriendly, unreliable and untrustworthy, that it’ll prefer to deal with its own problems (some caused BY the UK Gov).

    Posted 4 years ago #
  30. I were right about that saddle
    Member

    Met a Scottish friend last night who is applying for an Irish passport through his Ulster Unionist father's birthright. His Brazilian wife is doing same through a grandmother born in Cork. So's his dad.

    The Conservative party has no idea what it's started.

    Posted 4 years ago #

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