CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Debate!
Do we need an EU referendum thread? (Brexit thread)
(3978 posts)-
Posted 5 years ago #
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Are we just completely and utterly <rule 2>ed?
Posted 5 years ago # -
Yes. (this isn't just cynicism - I'm afraid)
Posted 5 years ago # -
“Are we just completely and utterly <rule 2>ed?”
Is Brexit more important than Climate Change...
What is the EU for?
(Might be why some people don’t like it. Bigger fine than Vote Leave just got!)
Posted 5 years ago # -
Can Vote Leave actually pay the fine? Their function was to accept donations and channel them into campaigning - so if they did it right, they won't have any money left to hand over.
Posted 5 years ago # -
The people who funded the campaign for the UK of GB&NI to leave the EU could pay that fine with a casual look down the back of their sofa. Daren Grimes will be thrown to the wolves, everyone else will swan off by some miraculous means.
We're not completely <Rule 2>ed until someone in military uniform chairs a cabinet of national unity but I am pondering Krav Maga lessons and a food and fuel stockpile.
Posted 5 years ago # -
“they won't have any money left to hand over“
Presumably they have/had directors - think some are in the Cabinet.
Posted 5 years ago # -
The prime minister no longer controls her own imploding party and Brexit has become synonymous with political crisis and stalemate.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Dairy products 'may become luxuries' after UK leaves EU
I'm seriously contemplating buying a chest freezer so I can stockpile French butter.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Posted 5 years ago #
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That's the EU issued the cliff-edge warning notices to all sectors.
Tin hat time;
As of the withdrawal date, a driving licence issued by the United Kingdom will no longer be recognised by the Member States on the basis of this legislation.
As of the withdrawal date, licenses and certificates for train drivers issued in the United Kingdom will no longer be valid in the EU-27.
Etc etc etc etc etc etc etc.Posted 5 years ago # -
Private actors, business operators and professionals need to take responsibility for their individual situation, assess the potential impacts of a cliff-edge scenario on their business model, make the necessary economic decisions and take and conclude all required administrative steps before 30 March 2019. The citizens who will be affected by the withdrawal of the United Kingdom, as well as the public administrations that serve them, should also prepare for 30 March 2019.
Posted 5 years ago # -
We are, aren't we? There's no question about it.
Posted 5 years ago # -
@fimm
I think so, yes. EU businesses will now remove UK businesses from their supply chains whatever happens.
There is a way out but it won't be painless and this isn't the thread for it.
I can't think of another time a democratic government has pursued an explicit policy of societal breakdown. You get war, disease and disaster but this is planned, deliberate and highly visible.
Posted 5 years ago # -
I 'love' the media's belief in British exceptionalism.
Media has been trying to frame this as a 'one nation' type debate, but up here but it doesn't feel to be getting traction.
The problem is that the Scottish Remain campaign did work. We looked at the options of remaining in a Union (for the second time) and voted consistently with that. Despite attempts to 'Britify' the opinion here it seems that we are stuck with our triple identities of British, Scottish and European (shuffle to taste).Media always wheels out Tom Harris, director of Scottish Vote Leave. He then tells us it was a UK vote so the Scottish dimension he unsuccessfully fronted was not really relevant (although it did have a campaign here).
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-44866309
Just to remind people that staying in the EU had a more consistent map colour than staying in the UK.
https://www.scotlandineurope.eu/
I note there are no mass movements to support Brexit in Scotland (or rUK) and that Indy events have feeble counter demos.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Talking to my mother on the phone. She's just back from Hungary. One friend there has joked (but not totally) abkut sending food parcels after Brexit. Mother also very aware that the free OAP public transport she used while there won't, presumably, be available to her next year...
Posted 5 years ago # -
Can't report my half of the conversation. Too much Rule 2. Meanwhile, my closest friend is on holiday in Denmark - near where as an 18 year old I worked as an au pair - seamlessly, by showing up in Denmark, and then spending an hour one afternoon standing in line to get the Danish equivalent of a National Insurance number.
Posted 5 years ago # -
That's us in new, uncharted waters.
Farewell, United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
And Gibraltar.
Posted 5 years ago # -
You talkin' to me? You talkin' to me? You talkin' to me? Then who the hell else are you talking... you talking to me? Well I'm the only one here.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Consumers and companies will be given detailed advice in weekly “bundles” from the start of next week on how to prepare for “a disorderly Brexit”, under government plans.
Posted 5 years ago # -
Farewell, United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Silver linings and all that!
Posted 5 years ago # -
Is the government really going to allow us to fall into the chaos that a disorderly Brexit will bring? What would they have to do to stop it? Is there anything "we" can do? It feels that the answer to the last question is "no".
Posted 5 years ago # -
@fimm
Only way out that I can see;
Posted 5 years ago # -
“Is the government really going to allow us to fall into the chaos that a disorderly Brexit will bring?”
This simple answer is probably yes.
As time drags on, the EU might be glad to continue without the UK, but it can’t just let UK leave on any old terms it chooses (even lowest common denominator, lightweight, post-Chequers ones).
It’s not about ‘punishing the UK for daring to be different’, it might not even be about fears that other countries will want out too.
It’s about rules. Some of them might not suit certain newspapers (not just the ones they make up), some business people, politicians etc, but -
The UK is in a club, it signed up years ago. OK that was done by different ‘directors’. In the meantime it has successfully got rules changed and added to.
Now the UK is reduced to ‘look the British people want to leave. We don’t normally pay much attention to what they want, but this time we are going to. By the way, we actually really want to be quite close to you (aligned maybe) and no extra disadvantages - like borders or extra customs paperwork.’
No wonder it’s not going well.
It’s probably too late for many politicians to admit ‘it might be better just to stay in’.
Obviously there are many people who really want out for misguided or genuinely good reasons. Unfortunately, for everyone, the full-on Leavers have managed little more than ‘it’ll be GREAT’.
The £350m for the NHS has already evaporated and/or been earmarked for other things.
Hard to know how this will work for those wanting Scottish independence.
If Brexit isn’t the predicted disaster then ‘ooh look it’s better to be out of things’.
If it is a disaster then how many people will be thinking ‘surely independence can’t be worse?’
There’s unknowns.
Then there’s unknown unknowns.
Posted 5 years ago # -
It might be best to avoid booking any air travel for next summer. The worst case scenario involves closing air traffic until new rules are in place.
A third runway at Heathrow looks a fairly bleak prospect if no airlines remain based in the UK.
Posted 5 years ago # -
A third runway at Heathrow is an environmental disaster, but I don't think this is the most useful approach to making it obsolete...
Posted 5 years ago # -
The fact is that the Brexiteers don’t really care about the union. They are English nationalists whose lifelong ambition is to sever any links between the England and the EU and they’ll destroy anything in their path, including peace in Northern Ireland, to get it.
Posted 5 years ago # -
“
Instead it’s been slow, soft and catastrophic. The OBR confirms there will be no “Brexit dividend” for the NHS. In all circumstances short of a no-deal Brexit, Britain will actually lose control of its trade and regulations. May, meanwhile, is in a panic-stricken funk.
...
I want the party to offer a Norway-style Brexit and a second referendum on the final deal. I want this because I know it can give the people on the streets in London and Edinburgh a common project with the people on the streets of Durham, and would allow Corbyn’s Labour to hegemonise progressive politics.
“
Posted 5 years ago # -
No civil servant or central banker could legally sign off a no-deal Brexit and Parliament will not allow one.
Mr Mason hasn't understood the situation. No-deal Brexit is the default automatic legal outcome of triggering Article 50. No further signatures are required from anybody.
Posted 5 years ago #
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