Chap on hybrid commuter, red top, 6pm going along Murieston place turning left on to Russell Road who cut the corner by mounting the pavement between the bollards there at some speed. Its a blind corner and if a pedestrian had come round it they'd not have had a hope. A prize doofus.
CityCyclingEdinburgh Forum » Debate!
Today's rubbish cycling
(4520 posts)-
Posted 9 years ago #
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It's nice when your impression of someone as a bit of a turnip gained initially from the way they overtake you is borne out shortly afterwards by the way they barge in front of a tram and then by the way they go through a clearly very red light.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Following someone this evening (on Gogar Station Road as it happens) and they were riding round a blind corner on a narrow road with no bike lane, lane markings or anything, actually on the outer of the double yellow lines.
I was behind them in primary position muttering to myself "take the lane, take the lane" because if they carry on like that they are going to have a scare from a close pass sooner rather than later.
I considered offering some words of advice. Should I have, do you think? Is there any way to do that without it being patronising? If it should be done, how can it be done while cycling beside someone? Does the fact that they were a different sex from me make any difference?
Posted 9 years ago # -
@Greenroofer - it's a tricky one. I know that your intentions would be the best possible, but I think there is a problem with unexpected and unsolicited advice. Part of the problem is that the initial context is unclear and often not even understood (wind noise etc), so no matter how friendly or helpful your intentions, the initial reaction will always probably be a bit shocked and defensive. The other problem is that some people feel naturally as if they are safest in the gutter despite all evidence and training to the contrary - I have quite frequent contretemps with my wife about this (alas).
Posted 9 years ago # -
@greenroofer
I don't think you've got much hope to be honest. Even if you managed to convince the person that it's legal (which many beginners and non-cyclists don't believe), and that it's safer there's still a large experience gap to leap before people will actually make that step. All you can do is sow seeds of doubt about the accepted wisdom of riding in the gutter.
Posted 9 years ago # -
@greenroofer if anything, it may have been worth saying that the painted lines are likely to be rather slippier than the normal road surface in wet conditions (it was damp when cycled home at least), although that may have resulted in them cycling in the gap in between instead?
Posted 9 years ago # -
@greenroofer
Not verbally, no. Overtake, and sit in primary for a bit?
Posted 9 years ago # -
@IWRATS - good idea. I've also (following a wise suggestion) put a thing on our work BUG site about riding in primary, on the assumption that they work in the same place as me...
Posted 9 years ago # -
Was me, twice in little over a mile, and the worst thing was my 2yo was on the back. She was screaming because she wanted to say bye bye to her Mum who she would see at home in less than 5 mins, but didn't understand. That is no excuse for me...
The first one was looking left, as I exited her nursery, to the top of the hill <100m away as I approached the junction and then I looked right, saw nothing and went. In the meantime a car had come over the top of the hill and we had to take evasive action.
The second was rubbish bike maintenance, I had ridden down steeper hills successfully this morning and brakes worked absolutely fine. However was going well down a hill when lights turned red when I was a good 50 yards away. I applied the brakes and then my feet on the ground, but couldn't stop in time and had to go through them. On checking at home the front pads had worn far enough that they no longer could stop the bike and the rear brakes (replaced last week) were not enough on their own to stop a good 140kg of bike and passengers on a downhill.
All very sobering and not a good look for those who witnessed it. I also wish I'd gone back to the pedestrians at the lights and apologised.
Lessons (re)learned - double and triple check at all junctions before turning and check the wear and test the brakes before each ride.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Lots on the lampposts by the path up to the school. Also lots of extremely dozy overtakes just after I set back off.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Poltroon who undertook me at high speed with no warning as I got ready to tackle the tramlines at Haymarket. He made no effort to slow down for some pedestrians who were crossing and bullied his way through.
Part of me was hoping that karma would kick in and he'd take a tumble on the tracks.
Posted 9 years ago # -
A wheelsucker on the Innocent this morning. He caught up after I turned onto it at Bingham, as there was a slower person to pass, but then stuck behind until I impolitely urged him to cease, whereupon he went all racing-trousers up through the tunnel.
[+] Embed the video | Video Download Get the Flash Video Posted 9 years ago # -
tbh, I wouldnt exactly call that a wheelsucker, there was a good 2 or 3 bike lengths distance between you both.
How much distance do you expect between you and others?
Posted 9 years ago # -
I'd agree with Zesty at the moment it certainly looks like the guy behind would have plenty space to adjust to any unexpected changes in your velocity. Although it's such a short clip perhaps it doesn't tell the whole story.
Posted 9 years ago # -
"How much distance do you expect between you and others?"
More than that. If I can hear puffing and clicking, it's too close. If he had just been waiting behind me momentarily as we passed people in the opposite direction for a safe opportunity to overtake, that sort of distance (plus another bike-length) would be momentarily tolerable, at lower speed. However, he'd been there or closer since the end of the park and was clearly going at my speed rather than his own.
Posted 9 years ago # -
@wingpig
I think you are asking too much there. I would call someone a wheelsucker if they were within 1 bikelength and I was unsure if they could stop if I had to.
Assuming his brakes are in full working order, 2-3 bike lengths is reasonable not to interfere with your ride, and enough time to stop in an emergency. It could be that your pace is the right one and the difference between him and you is so small that an overtake would take too long to be safe.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I'm with the other guys on this one wingpig - that's not wheelsucking.
It's OK for someone to cycle at the same speed as you.Posted 9 years ago # -
"I think you are asking too much there."
I don't. There was far too little space/time for him to be able to avoid a collision if I had to suddenly stop/swerve. Do you not seek some form of acknowledgement from someone if you're wanting to play racing-bicycles and tuck up close behind someone?
Re:speed - mine was changing; his was adjusted accordingly. I have no problem with people going at the same speed as me, even at the same time, but object when they do it immediately behind me, with the apparent intention of staying immediately behind me.
Posted 9 years ago # -
That's not close, though.
At least, it isn't close if you are used to group cycling. Different people have different definitions of close, of course! You'd be done for drafting if you were in a (non-drafting) triathlon and you were that close.(How do you get your camera to spin round like that? And where is it mounted to get a clear view front and rear?)
Posted 9 years ago # -
I think maybe in this instance the camera does add a length or two - for me I would feel uncomfortable with someone that close. However, I actually find it more annoying when I'm overtaken by someone who then slows to a pace which puts me in that situation.... as @paddyirish says - all manifestations of the problem of having very similarly paced riders I reckon
Posted 9 years ago # -
There are two things here.
The definition of "wheelsucking" and 'etiquette'.
I normally consider 'proper' wheelsucking to be closer than a bikelength - fortunately it hasn't happened to me that often.
'Too close' is obviously subjective, but you know when it's happening because (for whatever reason) you feel uncomfortable - worse if it's a motor vehicle (especially a Lothian Bus...).
I think (some) cyclists ought to be more aware of this and, if they haven't got the power to overtake, should back off.
More annoying are the ones who make a supreme effort to overtake but can't sustain the pace and get in the way!
Posted 9 years ago # -
@algo
Great posts think alike!
Posted 9 years ago # -
If you like, try and replace all instances of my use of 'wheelsucking' with 'mudguarding' if 'wheelsucking' is a protected racing-bicyclist term with strict maximal bike-length parameters.
@fimm This isn't group cycling, though. I'm not clothed nor accoutred for racing; nor is my bike, with its rack, pannier, mudguards, dynamo and D-lock rattling in its non-dropped-handlebar bracket. The camera unclips fairly easily, which is one reason for recently upgrading. It's slightly less easy to clip back in, which is why it went in my pocket after this and didn't capture the ensuing exchange.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Yeah, I've got to say that looks fine to me given the speeds involved.
Obviously everyone feels slightly differently on this issue, and I have had a grumble before about people selfishly drafting along Corstorphine/St John's Roads without taking a turn but I think the most we can really ask for is that people don't behave recklessly. I'd say that guy passes the test.
Anyway, yesterday's silly cycling was me. On the canal towpath heading West just short of Ratho. Was sticking to the right where the surface is better and in a daydream when I heard a bell behind me. For some reason my instinctive reaction was to move left to the 'correct' side which obviously also happened to be the side that the other rider was going to pass me on. Apologies were exchanged and he went by on the right, catching his wheel on the edge of the path and nearly coming a cropper.
Moral of the story: don't change direction suddenly when someone is passing you.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Oh also, the guy who rang his bell before passing through one of the bridges on same canal towpath. I applaud him for that at least as I seem to have lost mine so am reduced to using my voice instead, but he made no apparent effort to slow down and wasn't going particularly slowly to begin with.
A pedestrian coming the other way would have been mown down. Basically it seemed the ring of the bell was a warning to get out of his way rather than a courtesy to walkers to let them know someone was approaching in the opposite direction.
Posted 9 years ago # -
"Basically it seemed the ring of the bell was a warning to get out of his way rather than a courtesy to walkers to let them know someone was approaching in the opposite direction."
Yeah there are people who do that - especially on the canal.
Posted 9 years ago # -
Me sitting in an ASZ waiting for the lights to change with a car behind me but otherwise, I thought, alone. I eructed loudly (and, may I say, very satisfactorily)and then realised that two bikes had crept into the ASZ without me noticing and were close behind me.
Sorry folks. If I had known you were there, I would have been more polite.
Posted 9 years ago # -
I think the following party has to follow their own judgement about a safe following distance. Same as in a car. It is in their interests to maintain this as in the event of an accident, they will be to blame.
Similarly it is their decision about whether an overtake is safe, the right thing to do at the time or not. It is part of the use of roads, cycle paths or other modes of transport. Trying to control what happens behind you is not going to help and more likely to cause accidents.
If I am driving and am uncomfortable about someone up my bumper, I indicate left and/or pull in at the next available opportunity. The moment's time lost is worth the release in stress and would only happen half a dozen times a year at most, mainly on unfamiliar country roads, where the person behind is a local who knows it well. It has never happened when cycling.
Posted 9 years ago # -
For people-who-think-this-is-acceptable's future reference: if behind someone with grey hair, gingery beard, grey LHT with brown Vaverts, usually black ¾ baggies, usually a green Karrimor pannier and brown Crumpler camera bag, stay further behind or go past.
I have had my mudguard run into by someone who was at least one full length clear when I had to slow down and stop for a ped/dog on the NEPN last year. Another time someone had to deploy their feet and bend double over their handlebars when they failed to consider that I might slow down when approaching the rear of a pedestrian when there was a cyclist coming in the opposite direction on the other side of the path.
Posted 9 years ago # -
@winpig, I think the key is if you slowed down and requested him to pass but he still didn't. If the rider in front makes it clear they don't want followed and adjusts their pace accordingly then regardless of distance following is poor form.
Posted 9 years ago #
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